Episode 1: Rene on his mentor, Pancho

SPEAKER_00 0:00

What's going on, y'all? Jesse here. In this episode, I'm gonna be interviewing my co-host and baby brother Renee. I'm gonna be talking about mentors, shovels, bench pressing lions. We're still trying to figure out the audio quality stuff. So thank you for tolerating the the funkiness that that is about to ensue. Please enjoy.

SPEAKER_04 0:29

Alright, so I wanted to talk about a co-worker of mine who just recently passed away last week. His nickname was Pancho. I won't use his real name. He passed away from COVID. And what happened? I just recently got the news about it. And I talked to his foreman too. And his his I asked his foreman what happened, and he said he was telling me about they were doing a repair on a sewer lateral. And it was a hot day, uh 104 degrees, and towards the end of the day, he said uh he needed to take a break, which is a red flag for Pancho because he's a hard charger. Like he's pushing. He's always pushing, he's uh he's motivating others to push. Yep. He's super positive. For so for him to ask for a break, it's a big deal. It's a big deal, right? And he was telling them like he's not feeling well. He came to work fine. They they called it a day and they took it easy. He got he got in the shade, he got in the AC, he hydrated, all everything you're supposed to do, following procedure, right? And uh he even let the supervisors know and everything. So he did everything right. It it was a Friday, so his week his weekend was about to start. Well, they got the weekend happened. He got news that Francisco's in the hospital now in intensive care, uh, diagnosed with COVID. Okay, and then a couple days later, he's gone.

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Is it safe to assume that he had COVID while he was working? He just didn't know.

SPEAKER_04 1:58

Yeah, that's safe to assume. Uh, from what I hear, uh, it takes like two weeks or something. Yeah, there's there's all kinds of different data, who knows, right? But but he was in intensive care and he had COVID. Yeah, we know that for sure, right? How long he had it, I don't know. Right, and he was he definitely was not showing symptoms until right there, until that hot day. So it could be heat, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 2:21

Who knows?

SPEAKER_04 2:22

It hit him, it hit him hard, and he passed away. He ended up passing. He he was Puncho was important to me because he he was like my mentor. I we have this culture in our company where the the okay, so the crew is made up, there's these things called crews, uh, and I call it crew culture, right? And the crew is typically two technicians, an oper a heavy equipment operator, and the foreman. That's a complete crew. Okay, and he was my operator. I was the the technician when I first started. My first year at my company, that that was our dynamic. I had an I had other partners that were in and out. They they dropped out during the hot summer and whatever. But uh it was it was me, Pancho, and my foreman for the whole first year consistently.

SPEAKER_00 3:26

And uh so in this first year, that was that your first year working, doing this type of heavy physical work out in the elements?

SPEAKER_04 3:34

Yeah, that was my first year ever doing hot physical work in the utilities. Okay, like I've done like PT exercises and stuff, but doing a work like uh fixing something, yep, yep, and focusing on a task that was not exercise. Oh, totally. I had never had any experience like that.

SPEAKER_00 3:52

Okay, and it sounded like you had some other people that were doing it and they can't like they didn't make it, they decided, man, this work ain't for me, I'm gonna go do something else.

SPEAKER_04 4:00

Yeah, it was so common for in our company for new hires to drop out during the summer because it's hot, you're you're in a hole, there's no breeze, all this stuff, right? Yeah, and they drop out, they drop out like flies. It's very common, super high turnover during the summer for that position.

SPEAKER_03 4:17

Yeah, I hear you, man.

SPEAKER_04 4:19

Yeah, so I didn't know anything, I did not know a damn thing about what the difference uh between shovels were. I didn't know what uh a water main was, which is what we were working on.

SPEAKER_00 4:33

Yep. So you didn't know what a shovel was?

SPEAKER_04 4:36

Well, I didn't know the the names of the shovel, like I didn't know the difference between a shooter. If you told me to get a shooter, a spade, or a square shovel, I would I would have to think about all which one's the spade and which one's the shooter.

SPEAKER_00 4:49

Okay, so you knew like you're learning all kinds of nuances about the trade, about the work that y'all are doing. I knew like next to nothing about the trade. Okay, for our audience, can you describe what a shooter is?

SPEAKER_04 5:03

The the shooter is that short shovel that it has like a long, slender head. Okay, and it's skinny and it's for digging deep, small holes. Okay. That's what a that's what the shooter says. That's what we refer to as the shooter.

SPEAKER_00 5:19

Okay, so each of these shovels serves a different purpose. Yeah, specific purpose. Exactly. And I didn't know that. Okay, I couldn't know that.

SPEAKER_04 5:25

Yeah, it's shovel is a shovel, exactly. You told me that was a shooter, uh, they're all shooters to me, right? At the time. So, and he he taught me these things, right? And and there was times where you know I there was overtime opportunities and stuff, and you you would work with other crews. Sure. You he was my assigned operator, but I could work with other crews over time. Over time, or somebody called in, they need an extra guy. Yep, things like that. I worked with other operators before and other foremen, and they were just jerks, man. Like, you what do you mean you don't know? And and then it there was a lot of no sabe, right? For the for our audience, no sabe means he doesn't know. No sabe nada, he doesn't know nothing, like you know, and you know green, green, green as grass. He's a greening, you he sucks, he's dumb, you know. That there's a lot of negative, it's it's a it's a hostile training environment, I would say, in my opinion. Okay, and so you need some thick skin, you need some thick skin for sure. You definitely need some thick skin to learn from scratch in our in our crew cultures, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:35

So, was there a difference from the way Bancho treated you to these other operators and foremen?

SPEAKER_04 6:41

Yes, okay, so total so that it was a slight, subtle difference that made all the difference to me in my life. Because yeah, he would he would joke and probably know and talk mess, but he would show you and he was patient with you when he showed you. Okay. So, like he'd say, No sabe nada, right? Okay, but here's how to do it, you know, and and he would show you how to do it, and he would give you the opportunity to do the work. You know, a lot of other people I worked with, they just take it from you. They just take you don't know nothing, let me do it.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

Can you describe a situation where somebody did that, like took it from you?

SPEAKER_04 7:17

Oh yeah, man. So I had a foreman once, what were we doing? We were doing a fire hydrant replacement. The hydrant part's what you see, right? Yes in the street, but underneath it has a fire hydrant branch, a 90, a valve, okay, a control valve. Sure. All that is underground, and it's about 20 feet of pipe, of ductile iron pipe, super six-inch diameter pipe, all this stuff, right? It's a big piece of equipment that I had never seen before. To me, I th I always thought the fire hydrant was connected straight directly to the main. Right. But that's not true. But so we were doing a repair and we're replacing it, and I had to replace it at the flange. Well, what's a flange? I didn't even know what a flange was.

SPEAKER_00 8:04

And what were the instructions?

SPEAKER_04 8:05

Go to the flange, go take off the flange, go take off the flange. What the heck is a flange? I just started uh two, three weeks ago, bro. Like what's a what's a flange? So I get in there and I'm like, okay, well, well, I know this is a pipe, so that can't be a flange. And I'm just going in there, kind of like trying to figure out on my own what the flange is. And all the while I'm in this hole, it's hot as hell, and uh, my foreman's just mouthing out, cussing at me, and you know, telling me I'm stupid and laughing with the other people, how stupid he is. And and uh I'm like, dude, I'm and I finally asked, I was like, well, which one's the flange? Okay, yeah, he said, Oh my god, and then he gets in the hole and he's he points at it all exaggerated, like how dumb I am. I was like, okay, all right, all right, all right. And he gets and he gets out, right? I was like, okay, cool. And I brought the wrong wrench. Okay, because I thought I could it had these bolts, right? And it looked like uh it looked like a 1516 socket, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:05

Right, cool.

SPEAKER_04 9:06

And I had that's what I brought, because that's what it looked like. And I brought it, and then I'm putting it on, and he's like, no, man, and he's like, you need the MJ. Go get the MJ. And I was like, what's an MJ? I don't know what an MJ is, man. So I go get the MJ. Or I go attempt to get the MJ, and at that point, my foreman's pissed, like, because I don't know anything, and he go gets it. He he gets the MJs, right? Which is a special wrench, especially for the fire hydrant branch, okay. For the fire engine flanges. He goes, And he knew all of this. Okay, obviously, he knew all of this stuff, and he he uh he finally had enough, and he's like, I'll do it, I'll just do it because you don't want to work. Oh so now I don't want to work because I don't know these things, yeah. And I was never taught these things. I could have asked, yes, but I don't know. I just didn't ask.

SPEAKER_00 9:55

That's so that's an that's a there's a couple things that I want to explore, right? Is one you didn't ask. Why didn't you ask? Because I was trying to avoid him saying I don't know nothing. But the fact was you didn't know, right? And and it's interesting because in I mean, I would say in our in our society, but more specifically in the industry of construction and maintenance and repairs and so forth, there's this behavior that we we have to know, and and asking or not knowing is a sign of weakness, a sign of failure. And that's false. Yeah, totally. But so this dynamic you're you're describing, I've lived it. I understand I've actually participated on both ends of it in my career. One thing that could have made a difference is ask, or just say, hey, I don't know. The other thing is this guy could have said, Hey, bro, let me take this down there with you. What you're looking at is the flange. This this is what the flange is. Look at it, right? It's a new age. We have laser pointers, right? You see that little little green dot there? That's the flange, go take it apart. Could have done that, didn't do any of that. He knew, sounds like he knew what was gonna happen and aggravated the situation so that it would happen, and then said, get the hell out of the way, let me do it. How'd that make you feel?

SPEAKER_04 11:11

I was pissed, I was so so angry and pissed. And like I I at the time I was like, dude, and and this isn't the first time he did it to me already.

SPEAKER_00 11:20

And I just regular behavior, and and you're not the only one that's experienced it. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_04 11:26

I was I was pissed and I wanted to quit. I was like, man, this shop sucks. I don't want to deal with this, but I hurt my feelings. I want to go home. Exactly. That's how I felt, right? I want to go home. Like, and uh, but you know, I had I have my kids and my wife at home, and you know, I can't quit. Like this time I can't quit, right?

SPEAKER_00 11:43

They're different.

SPEAKER_04 11:45

So uh uh so I had to just you know take it, take it on the chin and and uh get you know get out the hole and and watch and observe, right? Yeah, which I had never seen it before.

SPEAKER_00 11:55

Okay, so fast forward to Pancho.

SPEAKER_04 11:57

So Pancho did those things. He he did talk to me like that. He did talk to me how you just showed me, right? How you just talked about how um, hey, this is the flange, this is what this is for, bring this in the hole with you. He did all that, yeah. You know, yeah, he made fun of me too, but at least he showed me as well. Yes, yeah, he showed me, he gave me the the information that I needed, yeah, right? And there was a language barrier too. He spoke mostly Spanish, and I speak mostly English, I know a little bit of Spanish, and a little bit of English, and a little bit of English, right? Enough to pass 12th grade. So there was a language barrier, but he still had the patience to guide me and teach me these things, man.

SPEAKER_00 12:43

It sounds like a special kind of dude.

SPEAKER_04 12:44

He totally was because there would be other I again, other operators with the same issues, and they're they don't want to have nothing to do with you, and they they all tell somebody else in Spanish to then talk to me instead of you know what I mean, and and then that's another thing, right? But he was like that, and and to me, he he was the standard, man. Like he was he was the standard, you know. Yeah, he wasn't all fluffy and super, you know, everything's going good all the time, but he at the very least, he he shows you, you know, he had an attitude and a work ethic that motivated people who didn't know. I mean, that's the best way I can say it.

SPEAKER_00 13:24

So it sounds like he was committed to developing he would develop his guys.

SPEAKER_04 13:29

I would totally say that. Yes, for free. Not for free, but like he he didn't expect I want to raise, you know, oh I'm training these people. He just saw it as part of his work, he just saw it as part of his responsibility. Doing his job to help you out, to help me, to help us, you know. He he that was his mindset. Special man. And and uh uh I mean I'll admit it, I sucked. I mean, I didn't know anything, I didn't know anything, and uh that's okay, you're new. Yeah, I'm I'm new, and and and then you know, a lot of people I personally I learned my learning style, I learned better on reading reading manuals, like seeing pictures in the manuals and step-by-step instruction on a manual and then doing it, but there's no manuals in on-the-job training, at least for us, there was so you you use the words on the job training.

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Was there was there any kind of training? Like you got hired, um surely there was orientation, these are your benefits, blah blah blah, all that good stuff. Many organizations they do that, but when it comes to orientation to the work that you're gonna be doing, that's typically lacking. Did you have any kind of orientation to the type of work you're gonna be doing, description of the tools, the types of materials, anything like that? Like outside of the ditch.

SPEAKER_04 14:44

Yeah, I actually did. So I'm not in the sit here. I actually did. They actually did give us a little crash course about uh what we're gonna be seeing underground, right? Okay, but it it was super what's the word, specific to a specific job. And in the hole with in the ground in the street out there, the ground in the street, the pipe, the water main in the street on Tassamata Street is gonna look very different from the the water main and on East Houston Street. Okay, that everything's different. There's different pipe types, there's different strategies for each pipe sizes, there's all kinds.

SPEAKER_00 15:23

So they just kind of And we learned on one.

SPEAKER_04 15:24

We learned on one pipe, which is cool, it's better than nothing for sure. But we learned about one pipe, about how to cut it one time. We went over one time how to cut it, one time we one time how to do common repairs, once. Okay, and and that was it, right? And uh and then that's more than zero. But that's more than zero, yes. Good, yes, yes, more than zero.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

Good math, I can do that.

SPEAKER_04 15:47

And uh, and that was that was it for that training. And the mo the rest of the training was mostly uh CDL training. Um driving the equipment and stuff, which I I have no complaints about that. Right. We had awesome training on that. We trained a lot, like like I would say for I'd say we get we got like 80 hours of training on CDL stuff. So I would say that like a good two weeks, maybe. Okay, yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_00 16:15

So um so on the job training, on the job training. It sounds what you're describing sounds more like on the job learning, not necessarily training.

SPEAKER_04 16:27

Uh yeah, on the job learning, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:29

Like there I agree with that. Go do this. With Pancho, it sounds like there was a training. It was training, yeah. Well with the other individuals, it was sink or swim. Right. So on the job learning, not necessarily training. They weren't focused at developing any skills and capabilities. Pancho appears to have been the other, right? Like he was like, know me, or let me show you.

SPEAKER_04 16:52

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 16:52

Okay, exactly.

SPEAKER_04 16:54

Exactly like that. He was he was into it too. Like he you could tell he enjoyed teaching you as well. Yep. Because some of the other people I've worked with, they're like sighing, oh my god, like you don't know this, like and you want to work here, and you know, just the attitude the whole time. And Pancho wasn't like that. Okay. I'll admit, I I was a slow learner at first. You know, it took me a good probably two months before I started blowing up. Like under his mentorship, like I just started, it all started to click. Like right at the two-month, I was like, oh, I get it now. And now I was doing repairs all by myself.

SPEAKER_01 17:33

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 17:33

I was doing them faster. I was motivated to go to the next job, yeah. You know, because I knew he was gonna back me up. And he and if I had a question, I knew he he could answer it and he wouldn't be a total douche about it. Yep. And uh, you know, I I started figuring things out on my own. You know, he taught me how to think instead of exactly what to think. Yeah, you know, and I could figure things out on my own, and and uh, you know, all of a sudden now I'm making the plan of what's what do I want to do? How do how do I want to attack this project? And he would he would support me on that, you know.

SPEAKER_00 18:09

Pancho sounds, I mean, he you said he taught you how to think, yeah. And and you so you're performing some problem solving on your own. You what's my strategy? I'm gonna do this work, I'm gonna get in there, and you were executing it independently. Those are all really huge things. So, Pancho, what was his level of education?

SPEAKER_04 18:33

Jeez, I don't even know if he graduated high school. Okay, I'm not sure. I don't remember.

SPEAKER_00 18:39

I know he was mostly Spanish, maybe a little English, but he probably chose not to speak English if he didn't have to. He didn't have a college degree, maybe completed high school, trade worker, right? Craft person working out in the street under the sun, but still had the capability to help you experience a greater quality of life. Totally. 100%.

SPEAKER_04 19:06

I I can say with confidence, he was the best mentor I've ever worked with. Wow. I have not, and I've worked in a bunch of different jobs, like office jobs, I've worked in education, you know, call center jobs, you know, where they need degrees to do to have the leadership uh roles, yep. They need to have a degree, and I've never had the level that Pancho showed me. Wow, that's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 19:32

Well, and I think that just goes to show education and degrees and certifications are absolutely important. Totally. Like, no way to downtalk that. But that doesn't the lack of those things, the lack of those credentials does not make a person less than that these people that we work with out in the industry are amazing human beings. Not all of them, some of them are all amazing, but some of them are amazing. Yeah. Um and and the lack of credentials doesn't mean that they can they cannot have an impact on people's lives. Exactly.

SPEAKER_04 20:09

Okay, yes, I would agree 100%. You know, he was all those things, man. He was all those things in a bag of chips. He he was important to he was like my family because we worked in the crews and he was he was my operator, right? And I was assigned to him and his crew. And like I was saying earlier, the the other there's two technicians, I was one, and the other one was always a new guy, because the new guy was always falling out. Yep. But I stuck with him. We would work 50 plus hours, you know, every week. Every week, man. So I was pretty much seeing him more than my family, you know?

SPEAKER_00 20:52

And uh I mean that's an important point, right? Because many of us get out there and we start these careers or jobs. So sometimes a job develops a new career, and we'll spend most of our waking hours with human beings that are not in our home. Right. Right? And so what you're describing is that relationship evolved into a family type relationship, totally major trust, and you're spending most of your damn time with them, you got the wife and the kids at the house, and they get some of your time, most of the time you spend with them, you're asleep, and they're asleep. And so that's a reality, right? And when you think about careers, you know, I I I get to talk to high school students and middle school students about what you want to be when you grow up, right? And a lot of times they're think people are thinking about a career and a job based on what their earning potential is, how much money could they make, right? Or whatever. Rarely do we discuss the fact that you're gonna be spending most of your waking time with these people. Away from the people that you love. And the way they treat you and the way they make you feel is critically important. Did you ever hear that message when you were in high school and in community college and all the things? Definitely not. Never? No, never. Never. Not once. Yeah, it's an important message. So Bancho was your mentor. We know Bancho's an amazing guy. And and he he fell out. He got ill.

SPEAKER_04 22:27

He fell out, he got ill, and he passed away. I went to his funeral last week. Or actually this Friday. Right. And you know, I've been to a uh quite a bit of funerals. I would say I've been to uh plus or minus 20 funerals in my lifetime. Wow, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:50

Young dude. That's a lot of people.

SPEAKER_04 22:51

I know, right? And uh either from our family or extended family or friends, you know, friends and workers and stuff. You know, I you look at the crowd at a funeral and you look at the family and you look at the people, and you know, they're most of the time they're sad. You know, they look sad, you can tell they're sad, they're crying, and there's a lot of crying and tears, and there's mourning, right? Yes. But Bancho's funeral was a little bit different because it wasn't, it was like, yeah, there was mourning, but there was like hysterical crying. You know, people were devastated that this man was gone, man. And it was a super passionate, there was a uh a little Bible study or service, funeral service, right, for him. And you know, the the pastor, uh and and uh Bancho was also a Christian, man, and he he talked, we talked regularly about our faith, and uh he he would he would tell me he knew his pastor personally, right? He was he had a relationship with his pastor too, and it showed the pastor was so passionate about this. I've seen other Bible serve uh funeral services, and and the pastor kind of reads what what they planned, and you know, this one was different. Okay, it was it was like like everybody that was there at the funeral was engaged in the funeral and and really knew Pancho and was affected by his death. So he touched everybody deeply, everybody, and it was hysterical crying, and and you know, I was thinking about it, I've been thinking about it since he passed away. I was I was sad, and I hadn't worked with him because I thanks to him, uh, you know, I was in the hole doing the job, and and you know, supervisors saw me doing the work that he taught me how to do, and I was able to move up, you know, and uh and thanks to Pancho's mentorship, uh so I hadn't worked with Pancho in a while. I hadn't worked with him in over a year. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

So he helped you advance in your career.

SPEAKER_04 25:05

Totally helped me advance in my career. Yeah, and um and he told me that too. Pancho even told me that he would always he believed in me, you know. He would tell me, When you're a foreman, Renee, when you're a foreman, uh you need to know this stuff, man. So uh uh pay attention. He would always say pay attention. He would say put attention. You say put attention, Renee. Yeah, put attention, Renee. Freaking Pancho, man. He was like so.

SPEAKER_00 25:30

He was speaking your future.

SPEAKER_04 25:32

He was speaking my future, man. Nobody else did that. Everybody just talked to you like you're always gonna be in the hole, man. And and it it almost seemed like they wanted you to stay in there, like they didn't want to show you a secret so that you wouldn't surpass them or something. Uh and Pancho was not like that, he wasn't concerned with keeping you down so he can stay up. He wasn't concerned with that stuff, man. Anyway, and it showed it showed in that funeral that I'm not the only one that feels this way. He impacted everybody like that, and it hit me, man. It finally I after seeing that, and and and they put his coffin in the hole, man. I just started bawling in tears, dude. I I was man, I was a mess. And uh I wasn't expecting that. I wasn't expecting I didn't see that coming. Then, you know, anger and resentment started coming in too, started creeping in too.

SPEAKER_00 26:29

So where did that come from?

SPEAKER_04 26:30

So I was I couldn't help but think, and here's where we get into the nitty-gritty and the purpose of this conversation. Okay I couldn't help but think our at our company headquarters, the whole all of the headquarters was our office jobs that has all the HR and the the executives and the the the money move makers in that building. They the since this COVID happened, we've had these phases, right? And our one executive made the the move that hey, you know what, we're just gonna have headquarters stay home all the whole rest of the 2020.

SPEAKER_00 27:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 27:17

All everybody who works at headquarters, you're you're gonna work from home till 2020 ends.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 27:23

And meanwhile, everybody else who's doing the the work to keep the water going, you guys still work. You gotta go work. Yeah, and you gotta go work, and you're just nothing happens for you guys, right? And I couldn't help but think, man, what if Pancho got to stay home? Like your headquarters people, you know what I mean? What if Pancho got to stay home? I don't I'm not saying Pancho got COVID while on the job. I'm not saying that we will never know, really. I I will never know those facts. How how that happened, and I'm not even suggesting that that's what happened, but but the the life, if he was at home, if he would have got COVID any day of the week, he would have been home with his family, and and they could have enjoyed the last bits of life he had, man. And and we don't have that opportunity, our our jobs that are not in the headquarters in the office, the people out there, we don't we don't get that opportunity. And I understand, you know, I understand that it's different, you know. We have to go. If we don't do our job, there's not gonna be water, you know. We need to repair the water maids and all of that stuff. We we need to keep the water going. I mean, that's that's undoubted. That there's no doubt about that. But I feel I felt as if there's there was a disparity in between the effort placed in preserving HQ's life over our lives, the the laborers' lives. Yeah, there was a there was a more heavy-handed approach on way, we gotta get these guys home, keep them safe, but us not so much. I don't see that. I didn't I didn't feel that that was communicated to us that it was important that we're safe. Okay, or at least that it was important as important to keep us safe as the other guys who get to work home.

SPEAKER_00 29:21

Okay. So what I remember, weren't you working like a week on, a week off at some point? What was that about?

SPEAKER_04 29:28

So uh, and that's my next point, man. Uh that's one of my points, is uh so check it out. So in the beginning when COVID just emerged, we were we were getting recent updates on our on our email about COVID and the numbers and all what's going on, how to how to take precautions and stuff. Great. Uh you guys need to wear a mask, all the procedures were going on, and they were sharing us the information on how to keep us safe, right? Yep, which is awesome. I think that's great. And then the numbers started getting worse and worse, and then you know, uh the state of emergency mess a message came out, and then that's when companies started closing down. Right. Right. And then during that time, that's when our company said, All right, guys, we're gonna we're gonna go in phases, we're gonna start having people work from home, and we're gonna start kind of experimenting on how that what that looks like. So the people who didn't work in the cruise, which was me included, I I don't I no longer work in the cruise, I really work by myself now. Uh occasionally I have to work with the crew to help them out on something, right? But uh I mostly work for myself, by myself. So, you know, people who worked on their own and had their own uh company vehicle, they they didn't get to work from home. Uh the the field workers, they didn't get to work from home, but they can come in bi-weekly.

SPEAKER_01 30:55

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 30:56

So and you would get paid 40 hours anyway. So uh it was like an A team and a B team, A worked week one, B worked week two, and all that. That's how we were doing. If you had your own vehicle, you did that. And plus, you we got a percent, I'll say it a percent that was under 15% bonus on our hourly or on our on our pay, right? Okay. Uh for the times you worked on the field. Yes, when you were actually out working. Okay, that was the thing, that was the solution, right? So, okay, cool. Uh, and we were doing that, and that was great. I thought that was completely fair. Uh and the even the crew workers got to get that.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

Yeah, it's extra money.

SPEAKER_04 31:40

They got to get that, and they too also got to work A and B shift. And they also had a policy where we no longer clock in at the time clocks, because at the time clocks, everybody's puddled waiting for seven o'clock and waiting for 5 30 at the end of the day to wait. So, hey, to avoid the spread, just don't clock in, or HR is gonna clock you in, right? That was the solution. Cool, that's awesome. These are great steps that I mean a lot of other companies are not taking, right? And that was great, and that was like phase one or whatever. I don't remember the numbers, you know. Phase one for HR, they had whatever that was. I don't know. I don't know what their phase one was. And then the numbers we were we were starting to flatten the curve, right? We thought we were, right? We we it was being communicated to us that the curve was flattening, right? So then restaurants were opening and bars were opening, everything was opening. So naturally, okay, so now let's start bringing people back, right? So he was the first, I would say, an orange flag to me. So let's bring, let's we started bringing people back, and now that we're back, the COVID was still going on, the numbers were were still soaring in certain places, there's hot spots, right? So we all come back now, which is fine. You have it's a little bit safer, right? So, but now that you're back, let's take away your 10% or whatever percent you were, whatever percent you got, and let's take away your percent and just go back to work, right? Okay, I mean that kind of sucks, but hey, at least I have a job, you know. But the headquarters stayed at they stayed working from home, okay. So I was like, mmm, all right. I was a little disgruntled about that, okay. And then the numbers started rising again, and now everything's closing down again. So the numbers are at its all-time high. And then we get notifications that not only are you guys coming to work now, but you also need to start clocking in again. So the numbers are worse, and we need to clock in now. So now you brought us back and took away our bonus, and then you brought us back working like normal, and and the numbers are worse, and now you want us to clock in too. So adding risk. You're adding risk, you're adding risk, right? And uh it's and then, but all the mean oh, and then at the same time, they gave us that message that you all you guys are all coming back and we're taking away the bonus. Uh HQ's gonna stay till 2020 ends. So we come back and you take away the risk, or you add risk. Meanwhile, HQ's getting to work from home the whole time, and they're the the risk for them is going down and staying down. So we got phased back in, but there was no phasing from them. They always they always got to stay at the maximum safety risk factor, or whatever you want to call it. And uh, and then and I was thinking about all that stuff, man, when when Francisco died, and uh, I was like, what the heck, man? Like, what's going on here?

SPEAKER_00 35:03

So here's a question. I mean, I guess it's a passionate, real thing through, right? Yeah, and and and really you're not the only one living, right? This isn't this situation, this dynamic is only happening, it's not confined to San Antonio, Texas. Right, but it's happening all over the country.

SPEAKER_04 35:21

Right.

SPEAKER_00 35:21

And and the dynamic of some people being having the uh opportunity to work from home and others having to go out and into exposure, potential exposure at risk. This is a big heavy subject.

SPEAKER_04 35:40

Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_00 35:42

And I'm gonna I guess I need to stay objective about it, which is probably gonna be difficult for some of our listeners, right? Because there's listeners that are gonna be in in one of those scenes, and both sides, both sides of it. So that's the reality that there are probably more than two sides, right? Oh, yeah, that I don't even know about. But here's one question. I or rather, I understand how well what the hell? Like, it's okay for us to go out there and be at risk and and make it to hide. But the re so here's a real question. An objective thought around this issue is can they effectively do their jobs from home?

SPEAKER_04 36:26

No, no, no, and I have a testimony to that. Okay, let's hear about that. Okay, some can. I will say some can. I don't even know what position could, but I I'll give them the benefit of the doubt that some can. Okay, but I have a testimony from my four person where he was missing a document. Right? He needed this document before at a certain time, and he contacted the person that was working from home, and that was their duty. One of their duties is to give give the document, right? And they're like, Well, I can't give it to you because I'm not at the office, and I can't go to the office, and I can't give you this document. So that I mean, that's one situation, right? But probably happens.

SPEAKER_00 37:12

I wonder how much other situations situation, but it's a real situation. Now, I think what I heard you say was the they took the office, what do you call it? Headquarters. They're all working from home, and and they could do their job from work. Not entirely, not entirely problem, but so could you and your crews do your job from home?

SPEAKER_03 37:38

No, definitely not.

SPEAKER_00 37:39

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 37:40

Absolutely not. I don't deny that for sure.

SPEAKER_00 37:44

And so that's the challenge, right? Is one our system, this is my personal opinion, and I've done no research, I've made my observation. Our system is not designed to protect and care for everybody. Our systems are designed to make money. Have I made money? I personally have made money, yes.

unknown 38:10

I've got it.

SPEAKER_00 38:11

And we all really have a choice, we could all choose to work. Or rather, we could all choose not to go to work.

SPEAKER_04 38:22

Right. That that's a fair saying totally fair.

SPEAKER_00 38:25

But what happens if you don't go to work?

SPEAKER_04 38:27

If I don't go to work, I don't eat. I don't get paid, and I don't get to eat, and I don't get to pay my bills.

SPEAKER_00 38:33

So that that's a reality. Now let's strip it down in how much of your income is really spent on necessities versus luxuries.

SPEAKER_04 38:51

I mean, without getting into a budget crunch numbers, like talking to numbers, I would say at least 80% of it is necessity.

SPEAKER_00 39:04

Is necessity, I would say. That's that's a good that's a pretty appropriate percentage. Now, let's think about the word necessity. Is cable a necessity?

SPEAKER_04 39:16

I don't have cable.

SPEAKER_00 39:17

Okay. Is internet access a necessity?

SPEAKER_04 39:19

Yes, I need it for work. Do you pay for that or does it I pay for that? Well, I guess I don't need it for work, but it's helpful to have so I can research certain things. Okay, alright, you're right. I'll give you that. It's not a necessity. It's helpful. I need it for work.

SPEAKER_00 39:35

Do you have a company issue phone?

SPEAKER_04 39:37

No. But they give me a phone stipend which is like uh X amount of numbers. Well, it's fair, it's fair. Technically, I'm not paying for phone. For my phone, but my wife's phone.

SPEAKER_00 39:49

Now I'm gonna get a little deeper, right? We'll talk thinking about necessity. Like it's a predefinition. Sure. Do I need a refrigerator?

SPEAKER_04 40:00

I mean, you could survive without it.

SPEAKER_00 40:02

So now we're talking about survival. Survival, yeah, sure.

SPEAKER_04 40:06

Survival.

SPEAKER_00 40:08

I don't need a refrigerator. Do I need electricity?

SPEAKER_03 40:12

No, guess not.

SPEAKER_00 40:13

Do I need a cell phone?

SPEAKER_04 40:16

I need a cell phone to communicate with my family members, and it's okay. To survive, no. I'll say that. No.

SPEAKER_00 40:25

Thank you. And I'm going somewhere.

SPEAKER_04 40:26

That's fine. That's fine.

SPEAKER_00 40:27

So I don't need a cell phone. Do I need a car?

SPEAKER_03 40:29

No.

SPEAKER_00 40:30

Don't need my cell phone, right? And I'm pretty sure your car payment can be over a hundred bucks a month.

SPEAKER_03 40:35

It's like 350 bucks a month.

SPEAKER_00 40:38

Plus insurance.

SPEAKER_03 40:38

Plus insurance.

SPEAKER_00 40:39

Yeah. No.

SPEAKER_04 40:43

Do you need shoes? Do you need underwear? Okay.

SPEAKER_00 40:46

So now you're talking your clothes, right? What grade of clothes do we spend our money on?

SPEAKER_04 40:54

I mean, the cheapest kind. I mean, if we're speaking about my me personally, the cheapest kind. I don't shop at the mall. Cheapest kind, too. Okay. I don't even I haven't even bought clothes in a while because I buy for them for my kids and my wife.

SPEAKER_00 41:08

Of course. So my point in all of this is this is not a judgment on you. My point is that we have been conditioned to acquire things and buy things that are conveniences, not necessities. And so in the acquisition of these things, we develop debt. We accumulate debt. We accumulate or develop a lifestyle or a standard of living that exceeds what is necessary. In order to sustain that, we've got to have income.

SPEAKER_03 41:53

Yeah, sure. Don't deny that.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

So then we get trapped. I I believe it is a trap. And I know my thinking is kind of weird. But we create this trap of I gotta have all these things because they're like my cell phones, and don't get me wrong, I got two cell phones. One's my personal, one's work. I've got two computers. I've got I got a lot of stuff that I don't need. So I'm not judging, I'm just a straight-up observation. We have confused necessity with inconvenience, and so we create this debt and we create this need to have a job that maybe sucks with people that don't treat us respectfully, but we gotta do it, and we talked about it earlier. We end up spending most of our time with people we really don't like to pay for the things that we need in quotations for the people that we love that we spend very little time with. There's some adjustment in our thinking, right? How can we live in such a way that we can choose to do work that's meaningful to us and be surrounded with people that that we that make us feel appreciated and that we can appreciate in return? So that's one thing, right? And back to the system and the question that that that you're struggling with, it almost sounds like you're saying it's not fair.

SPEAKER_04 43:30

Yeah, I I will tell you that. I don't think it's fair.

SPEAKER_00 43:34

So if a lion were to devour you, you tell that lion, hey man, this this isn't fair. No.

unknown 43:43

Right?

SPEAKER_00 43:43

Why not?

SPEAKER_04 43:44

I mean, because uh the the lion is stronger than me, it was faster than me. Uh I c I it's physically impossible to, you know, outbench press a damn lion. You know, I can't I there's no amount of training that's probably gonna And it's just the natural behavior of the lion, too.

SPEAKER_00 44:05

Our system that we're operating under. This is the natural function of that system.

unknown 44:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 44:15

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 44:16

Just like a lion eating grass. You're right. That's the system. So what we wanna what it's easy to do is assign blame or irritation and frustration and judgment against the organization, and even worse, against the specific people that you envision in your mind as representatives of the organization.

SPEAKER_03 44:42

Right.

SPEAKER_00 44:45

Is it their fault?

SPEAKER_04 44:47

So and I I have that was another one of my points I wanted to touch on is okay, so I guess I'll touch on it now. Um I have two foreman, two four persons, right? One is and they're on both sides of the extreme, man. On both sides on the spectrum. So we got and uh I'm I feel like I'm gonna be referring to these people for a while because these guys are some characters, man. But okay, so we got uh his nickname is Bino. We got Bino, he's a grandpa. Uh I I call I refer to him as my grandpa, and like my within my team, my crew, we uh he's grandpa, right? And uh so my grandpa is on the side of hey, well, if you don't like it, go work somewhere else, right? And and there's some truth in that, I don't deny that for sure. And then my other guy, uh Foreman, um we'll call him Mr. H Mr. H, he's on the side, like, no, this is classism and classic classism. Um, there's a struggle for the piece of the pie, and HQ gets the big piece, man, and we we get the crumbs that's on the rest of the plate. I feel like I'm somewhere in the middle because I totally and I literally said this like verbatim to both both of them sat down and I was telling them I totally put myself in this situation because I was all heated and I was I was talking down about the company and stuff, not to anybody like that's gonna you know get me in trouble or anything, but like with between my my peers, you know, I was I was upset. I was upset. Pancho just died, and I was pissed. Um I was pissed and I was seeking ownership, I guess, to place blame. I was seeking to place blame. And um I was saying these things, and and then you know, I calmed down, and I was hearing both sides of the spectrum from both of them, right? That one guy's like, yeah, it's totally their fault. Even if it wasn't their fault, it's it's their fault still that you know they didn't still their damn fault somehow in the ripple of space, you know. And then the other guy's like, well, I mean, that's what we signed up for, Papa, you know, that's how he is. And and they're both I say, I don't say they're both right, but I'm more on the side of grandpa that you know, that's kind of what we signed up for, man. And I and I say that I say this, and I guess I would warn our viewers to take it with a grain of salt. This is my my opinion. That I put myself here in this situation that I I I have to take this weenie or whatever. You know, I have to take this situation, man. I have to take it because I can't just say, you know what, screw it, I quit. I'm gonna find a job that's gonna give me special special treatment, right? Quote unquote special treatment. Um I put myself to where I need this, man, or else I'm not gonna make it. And my family and my kids are not gonna make it. But uh so until I find the next the next grind, you know, uh hey, this is it, this is what it is, right? And I and I know, and on top of that, I also put myself in the situation where I can't really make a bold statement or move or policy change within the company in the position that I am. You know, I'm not I'm not laborer, but I'm not uh administrator either. You know, I'm just one step quote unquote above pay grade or whatever, you know, whatever you want to call it. Um and I can't really make a move like I can't definitely can't make a move like that, you know. I can't make a policy change to make this better for everybody. I can't do that, and I put myself there. You know, I I was on the path at one point to to make those changes, to be in a position of administrative or executive. I was on that path. I was going to college, and you know, I out of all the choices that I made, I chose to that it got me here, man. And and that's all my fault. And if I don't like it, I I need to do something about it. And right now I'm in this space where it's not a wise move, you know. So I I get that, man, but I feel and they brought me to my next thing. Are they the devil for what's going on? No, man. I don't I'm not suggesting that they're not e I don't think they're evil, and you know, the company's screwing us and classism and all that. You know, I I will admit, I must admit, I was I was totally saying those things, you know, a couple of days ago.

SPEAKER_00 49:42

There's some truth in those things.

SPEAKER_04 49:44

Sure. Right, sure. I can't get it out of my head that there is a disparity between I don't know, I guess the the compensation of what we do and and what I don't know headquarters does because they're they're working from home. I don't know if they're working all the whole eight hours they're getting paid for. I don't know, but I can't I can't prove that, right? But they're working from home. So so, in my opinion, I'll just say it, say I'll just say exactly what I said. I said they're working from home and they're probably not working the whole eight hours they're getting paid for.

SPEAKER_00 50:21

They're not having to clock in.

SPEAKER_04 50:23

They're not having to clock in.

SPEAKER_00 50:24

They don't want they're making me clock in.

SPEAKER_04 50:27

There's nobody keeping track of that. I don't know, maybe there is somehow, but there is a way. There's a way there's a way, but there's also a way you can loophole this your you could just leave your laptop open and move it every just like you can clock in and sit on your totally right. Yeah, you're right about that. Okay, but that's not what I'm getting at. My point is they're at home in the comfort of their home, not uh doing whatever they do, and I feel like there's there's a there's an there's a dollar value that's unspoken of being to be at home with your family, yeah, and working from home. There's a dollar value, whatever the hell that dollar value is, being to work at home and being safe from the COVID, or being just having the opportunity to stay safe at home, just having that opportunity. There's there's a dollar value. I don't know what it is, I don't know the equation, right? But I feel like there's a dollar value, man. And we came back and we I my opinion, we're not getting that dollar value. We we yes, we have to do our job. Like, if we don't do what we do, the there's gonna be chaos. There's no water if we don't do what we do, right? I feel like we're not getting that dollar value that they're getting. You know what I'm saying? Like, I feel like I and I don't even know if that's some absurd amount of money that's gonna give us, put us up, you know, under. I don't I'm not I'm not suggesting that, man, but like I feel like we're at risk. Yes, we're at risk, and we're not getting to work at home, and I feel like there's value in that. And we I feel like, in my opinion, it would be nice to be compensated accordingly for for doing that. And I don't think we are fair getting that fairly. I don't think so.

SPEAKER_00 52:17

I've heard a couple line of lines of thinking here, and I just want to ask for clarification.

SPEAKER_04 52:22

Got it.

SPEAKER_00 52:23

One was the situation is not right, and you and it sounded like you want to be able to make things right for everybody.

SPEAKER_02 52:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:34

So there's that's one line of thinking. The other line of thinking that I'm hearing is if I made more money, I'd be happier. If I made more money doing this work in this situation, it would be better.

SPEAKER_04 52:47

I would say it would be fair.

SPEAKER_00 52:49

I feel like those are conflicting ideas.

SPEAKER_04 52:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 52:53

Here's why. Because I'm really motivated, and I love listening to you when you were talking about the realization that taking ownership or you know, I'm in this situation because of decisions, a series of decisions I've made throughout my life, and that put me here. That is mine, and I gotta do something.

SPEAKER_03 53:12

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 53:12

That is motivated, it speaks to me. I've motivated and energized when you were talking about like just straight up, I am not in a position to have or affect the policy change that would be necessary to protect all of the people I care about that at work.

SPEAKER_03 53:30

Right.

SPEAKER_00 53:31

I was very motivated by that. Then you started talking about the money, and I get it, right? Money, want more money. But here's my fear, and here's why I'm it kind of has a little offset. If they if you got that money, whatever that volume value is, and I I agree, like, man, if we could put a number to that.

SPEAKER_03 53:52

That's what I asked you.

SPEAKER_00 53:53

I like that that that's a really interesting thought. I don't know if that's ever gonna happen, but it's an interesting thought. If you had that amount of money, let's just let's just say it's twenty dollars more an hour. If you had that additional twenty dollars an hour, and you and all your your co-workers, all the people you care about, they all had that extra twenty dollars an hour, this would not be an issue.

SPEAKER_04 54:23

Man, that's a good question. I mean my my quick answer is no.

SPEAKER_00 54:33

Okay, why not?

SPEAKER_04 54:35

Because the issue is I in my opinion, I think the issue is like it's like I mean, I'm just spitballing here. Is the real issue is like, hey guys, you we're gonna be safe over here and you guys do this, just keep doing what you're doing for the same amount that you always did it. Uh it's like almost like there's there we're I don't want to say we're pretending there's no risk, but it's like, yeah, there's a risk, just do it, just just do it how you always did it. I mean, don't worry about the risk, you know. I I just feel like there's a there's there there needs to be some kind of comfort. Like, for example, in the military, there's hazard pay. You get you get a certain pay for being in garrison, and and and then when you go deploy, you get hazard pay. And I feel like there and and hazard pay is uh I I assume it's like a significant boost. I don't I mean, sure, there's numbers about that, and I want to see the numbers on us too.

SPEAKER_00 55:38

Okay, but again, getting the hazard, we'll call it hazard thing, getting that hazard thing, does it make it right?

SPEAKER_04 55:47

No, it's still hazardous, but it's uh I mean, man, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 55:51

It's a you know what? Let me ask that differently. That doesn't make it right. Does it change the way you feel about your currently experienced?

SPEAKER_04 56:04

It's a hard one. That's a good question. I mean, I'm gonna say yes, because I I I would feel I would feel in my situation, like uh, you know, I'm I'm at risk, but it it's at least I'm getting paid for this risk, and it's uh Okay.

SPEAKER_00 56:20

So it sounds like yeah, it would minimize your angst and it would minimize the angst at least. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 56:26

Because we have to work, like you there's gonna be chaos, like I said, but we don't do it.

SPEAKER_00 56:30

So it would minimize your angst. You wouldn't be as frustrated and upset with the situation. And if you weren't upset and frustrated with the situation, would you still give a damn about changing the policy to make things right?

SPEAKER_04 56:43

Yes, I would.

SPEAKER_00 56:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 56:44

That's one of my motivating factors to move up in the first place.

SPEAKER_00 56:47

Amazing, right? So that's I'm glad to hear that because it's almost like we sell our souls. Yeah, I mean, pretty much. Like we, in exchange for money, if you just gave me hazard pay, and and now I think it's clear that this isn't what you're saying, but this is what I was concerned about. If I just had hazard pay, then I then I then I'd just go to work. But you recognize that that doesn't solve the problem.

SPEAKER_03 57:11

Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_00 57:12

There's still some policy, there's some problems with the policy and how how we're handling how your organization is handling.

SPEAKER_04 57:19

I would say it puts like a band-aid on the problem.

SPEAKER_00 57:21

It's a thank you very much. Absolutely. It's a band-aid, it's really not a solution. Uh so we have a bigger problem. Now, I think in kind of what you're questioning and frustrated about, it's this idea of I'm the field worker, they're the office executives, they don't really care, and and they get they have this luxury of hiding at home and working in their underwear, their ass, and they're making more money, and we're making less money, and they don't even care. I mean, that's a that's super simplified collection.

SPEAKER_04 57:53

Super simplified, but basically, I mean it all boils down to that pretty much. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 57:57

So I want to share with you a perspective from from an executive in some in my day job who we had the shutdown. Jobs were shut down, like the whole freaking thing. Nobody lives were of the utmost importance, and that lasted about a frog hair's worth of time, right? It was quick, boom, we went back at it. And she was dealing with she's the executive of this job where there's hundreds of men and women out there working to complete this project. She wholeheartedly believed it was the wrong thing to open her project back up and put people at risk. She's the executive, she's in charge, she cares, she makes the freaking decision. We also had a contractual obligation to the client to execute the work as scheduled. So she had she was faced with that decision. Violate the contract and deal with the repercussions, litigation, and all that other stuff, or put people at risk. And I know for a fact that that was a it still is a very difficult decision. I imagine that if anybody gets ill or were lose their life as a result of being exposed and gaining the virus and may not have passes, she would blame herself for that. Now I share that because she's a she's a human being and she does give a shit. She's not this stoic gargoyle examiner that says, yeah, put him to work, try to make more money. She really gives a shit. She doesn't want people to die or get sick. But because of the system that we're in, she had to make a decision contrary to what she would have preferred to make. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 59:51

Yeah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 59:52

And I and I share that. I'm not saying that every executive thinks and feels that way. Because if they did, everybody would be home right now without a concern for security, without a concern for food, without a like that would not be an issue. The fact that we're having to deal with this indicates that there are a large number of people, or maybe not even a large number of people, with a number of people with such an enormous amount of influence that feel and believe contrary. And the priority is maintain the economy, right? More money, bring the money that keeps this happening. There are those people. The system that we live in is what produces these things, these conflicts. Now, what I think is important about this whole situation, your situation, or what you're thinking, is use the perfect word. It's the policies that are in place. We can bitch and moan about how they're unfair and they might make us feel a little bit better, but it doesn't change anything. So the question I I'd like for you to pose to you or for you to wrestle with is what do you have to do as an individual, as a human being, as a contributor to society and all your friends and people that you care about, what do you have to do to change that? That's not a short-term question or a short-term answer. That's a long, long, long, long road. Going back to Pancho. Pancho made decisions as a person, as a man, to develop people and to invest in people. He's passed. And he's gonna be sorely missed by all the people that he touched, and by all the people that he's not gonna be able to touch. He made a decision to live that way, and he had an effect. How are you gonna choose to live?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:06

I mean, I got a solution for that. I've been thinking about that too. Okay, what do you think about it? I mean, totally well, first of all, I mean, model what Pancho showed me. Okay, develop my people that I work with and elevate them and continue to educate myself, get the certifications and the degrees or whatever necessary to keep elevating and to to get to the point, and I don't need I don't know what point that is yet, but to just I know it ain't where I'm at right now. So I know that point is somewhere in headquarters. So I need to my first immediate goal is get in headquarters somehow. Um so that I can start learning uh so I can start doing the same things, maybe modeling, making an impression on headquarters people around me, and uh start moving up there too, and to where I can get to the point where I can make that policy change.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:08

Or to or and maybe influence others around me to get the to be on our side, on the little guy's side too.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:16

Do you have to wait to be in headquarters until you can start affecting change?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:23

Um, I mean I think so, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:28

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:28

I think so.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:30

Did Pancho have to wait to get in headquarters to change?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:32

Oh, well, no, no, no, definitely not. Like, but Pancho, Pancho never changed any policies.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:38

Fair enough. But changed lives.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:41

Yeah, totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I could do all that right now.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:45

To have an appreciation for people to head in that direction. Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:50

And uh I feel I feel, and I've been told by people that I'm I'm doing that right now. Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:59

You've got to be responsible in the fact. Yeah. You're an influential man, but there's responsibility, like Spider-Man, right? Power is a great responsibility, and it's a real thing. Like you have the power of influence, you're a motivating, inspiring individual that happens to work in the trades. Right? Like, what do you mean I remember what do you think of when you think of a construction worker? Right? Or somebody who works in the trades and craft people.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:28

Yeah, I know what I've thought when I was in like high school is the trades is where you go if you didn't go to college. That's what I thought.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:37

Yeah. And now you're there.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:40

Down here.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:42

You've met amazing people. You are one of them. What do you think about them now?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:50

Um, geez. I mean, I think you you hit the nail on the head. They're amazing, hardworking, resilient, innovative people, and like very resourceful people. Like, I I when I picture a utility worker now, I'm thinking like these are the survivors of the post-apocalyptic earth, you know what I'm saying? These guys are gonna survive, like they're gonna build the ground up by themselves, you know, and just they're gonna be the ones, the backbone of our future, I would say. That's what I'm thinking now. That's how I think about them now.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:37

What's your advice to the 13-year-old Renee? Oh god.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:45

Man, if I I'm I mean, geez. I don't I wonder how politically correct can I be here, right? I mean, I would honestly I would tell them, I would tell them, I mean, nut up right now, dude. Like just start nutting up right now. Stop quitting everything that gets hard. It's gonna get harder. Train yourself now. Train yourself in being uncomfortable, train yourself in working and focusing when you're tired. Um and it's gonna give you fruit, man. And and and it's just so gratifying when it that those traits rub off on your peers, too. It's super gratifying, and just be I I guess I would say just be that standard that you want. I don't know, like, you know, I don't know. I don't know. I guess that's what I would tell them.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:44

That's my quick answer.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:45

Yeah, not up, really, not up.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:47

But more importantly, you said things are gonna be hard and don't quit. Yeah, and train yourself to be uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:53

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:54

I think those are great lessons for anybody there.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:57

Totally. Yeah, I think we can close with that.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:06

And that are it. That's it. Finito se acabo done. End of this episode. We want your feedback, we want your thoughts, we want your ideas, we want to steal them and use them. So please shoot us an email at Jesse J E S S E at learning and missteps, L-E-A-R-N-I-N-S N M I S S S T E P S dot com Talk at you next time.