Feb. 25, 2022

Avoiding Job Site Conflict, Investing in Your Employees, & Leadership Development for Tradespeople with Brad Anderson

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What are the best ways to avoid job site conflict? Why is it important to invest in your employees? What if there was a leadership and professional development course created by tradespeople for tradespeople? Well, get ready because this week’s guest has tons of insights on job site management and being a leader… PLUS, he’s creating that leadership development course we all need!


In this episode, we have our first insulator on the show, Brad Anderson! Brad is an entrepreneur and mechanical insulation professional that has worked in his family’s business for almost his entire life. 


Listen in to learn powerful strategies for avoiding conflict on the job site, growing and advancing as a construction professional, and thriving through The Great Resignation.


“Out of everyone I know who would be characterized as a millionaire, 90% of them were trade workers who started their own companies. That’s the way it should be presented to kids.”                                                                                                                              - Brad Anderson


“I’m just continually trying to learn and develop myself and become better and more impactful and it’s just something that I think anyone can do… Continue challenging yourself.                                                                                                                                            - Brad Anderson


What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

·       How to become a millionaire without going to college

·       Why you need to actively grow your leadership skills throughout your career

·       Why Brad is developing a leadership course by tradesmen for tradesmen

·       Overcoming the battle between communication, efficient planning, intentional learning, and urgency in scheduling

·       Thriving through The Great Resignation: The power of investing in your employees

·       Connecting Lean principles with leadership skills

·       What Brad wish he knew going into the industry: We’re all learning and figuring it out as we go…

·       Brad’s Learnings and Missteps: Inaccurate estimates, miscommunications, owning up your mistakes, and having the courage to have difficult conversations

·       Creating a safe space for mistakes, honesty, and transparency


Resources Mentioned:

How to Support and Grow the Trades Workforce with Christopher Brenchley of Rock the Trades: https://bit.ly/33lXn6m




Oh, my goodness allergies are whooping mob booty right now, forgot to take my allergy medicine. So please forgive the nasally sound coming through and no worry. The rest of this episode with Mr. Brad Anderson is clear sinuses all the way. Brad Anderson is an insulator and I'm particularly proud of. that, that I was able to secure a commitment from him to have a conversation because, you know, some people been calling me out for talking to a whole bunch of plumbers and only plumbers. And I may be a little biased with the plumbers. but on this conversation with Brad, we would get into some heavy stuff and we talk about leadership skills, uh, millionaire. And trades folks that have followed a path to starting their own business and becoming millionaires, like believe it or not, it can happen. And, you know, running a business requires heightened communication skills. And as Brad has progressed through his. He's now focused on building a leadership course to invest in his people and also invest in the trades period. And it's leaders like Brad that are going to win this battle that we're all having around the great resignation, because he is 100% investing in his people. And that's what we need. The companies out there that are doing that, I think have a, have an advantage on the risk that, that ain't as you listen, of course, I make some mistakes every now and then. Uh, and I share a little story about a pretty expensive duct ordering mistake. I made please take it easy on me in the comments about that one. It still stings a little bit. And before we get going to the show, God, I give the shout out to the patrons out there that have been supporting us along the way. And we just have a brand new one. Mr. Davis Hambrick of The Laying Foundations podcast is signed up as a patient. Davis, we appreciate you. My man, you just keep on giving and thank you for supporting our efforts in enhancing the image of careers in the trades and for the rest of you folks that are interested in contributing in some form or fashion and access to some exclusive content, uh, go to the website, learnings and missteps.com hit the become a member button and choose to contribute as you wish. As always, we are super grateful for you gracing us with your time. Uh, and here we go with Mr. Let's go in on L and M family. We got Mr. Brad Andersen here today, who, you know, y'all have heard us talk. We've had plumbers, a lot of plumbers, cause I'm a little biased. Had some sheet metal mechanics out here had some GC people and it's a. Insulators. You're an insulator by trade. Is that correct? Brad? Yeah. Well, mechanical insulator. That's where our trade is. I'm at the estimating project, managing everything else. End of it now. I couldn't find any picks with through my background is all HVC system and like, oh, is that a control? It's just exposed, but what the hell? I'll throw it up there. There was some duct work with yeah. VAV box there just for the hell of it. Cause it was a better than the background of my house here. So, but, but yeah, we do mechanical installation. And Ben in that it's been a family business. My father started doing it when he was 18. So that was back in 1969 and then eventually he started a company and then, you know, I've worked there my whole life. We ended up selling to a larger firm, but you know, I'm still working for the company I have. And and the other farm too. So it's it's been a journey and, you know, a lot of, a lot of interesting people, a lot of Interesting things you see going around different sites, different you know, facilities and plants. Those are some of that times, the coolest things like manufacturing facilities, where they make stuff. Wow. I never thought about how something like this was made. And then, you know, seeing it going on like a steel Foundry and saying like, it was like, okay, this is something different and, you know, just gets, it's interesting to get around and learn how, like all sorts of things have done, not just, you know, building a regular construction building and the thing over and over. I know my experience was, and when I talked to folks here on the, on the podcast, No. I think when we, I feel like when we talk about jobs and careers, we talk about like the work that we're going to do. And when I say we I'm talking kids, right. When we're talking to kids, like, what do you want to do? What do you want to do when you grow up in this sort of. But we really forget to talk about the experiences that we're going to have, like the adventures that the work can or cannot provide or the relationships right now, amount of people. I mean, how many people have you met and formed relationships with in the course of your career? Oh, I mean, I couldn't count that. You know, some of them come and go, but I mean, you know, upper high hundreds over a thousand, I mean, it's just you know, and then sometime, maybe five years later, I get a phone call from someone I knew 10 years ago, you know, five years ago, actually, what I just said that, but that I haven't seen, but then, oh, we got something going on. And it's just those ongoing relationships that you know, obviously you can only be close to a certain number of people, but it's just the amount of people, different types of people, people doing different things that you come across in this industry is it's quite remarkable. Yeah. And yeah, and, and so then we get social media and then you can connect with all kinds of people. So how, how did you and I connect Mr. I was trying to think about that this morning. I think it started like sometime over the summer, I was listen to audio book by a wr Edward Demings about you know, the entire lean philosophy. And then I was thinking, you know, this there's gotta be something to do with that with construction. How does that apply to. To this. So I started looking stuff up and I think I came across your podcast when you were going over the lean builder, which is right over your right shoulder there. Which you know, I, I love that. That was the first I think my first experience with you. And then I ended up buying the book and the audio book version. It wasn't the audit brokerages, which is, is I really liked it. It was good. Really good. Listen. And then we're starting to go over an idea to get some sort of leadership development thing going in my company. So she's like, why not kind of work with some of the lean things? I think that's why I reached out to you and connected, and we just started talking about it. But it's just funny how you come across people and Everyone's willing to talk and share their experiences. And I just find like, in anything people, if you're really reach out to them, the ready to be very helpful And of course you were very helpful. You know what? We started at our companies and you know, now what I'm working on is kind of where we stopped. I wanted to go get a lot more into, because we started a leadership program, but we really did it as ended up being more of like an internal leadership, like stuff. not so much protocols, but you know how the company is operated the two companies together. And it would be a great experience for everyone, but I was thinking how there's something more that we're missing. I really need to get deeper into that leadership end of things, like as a focus. So I started, I was thinking about, I said, okay, well, I'll start work of the program myself. Then, then I thought about. And I said, you know what, I'm working, what I want to work on is it can be applied to every trade and not just one company or not just our one trade. Then the leadership aspect of it can apply everywhere. So then I started really going over with things and I actually touched base with you about that again. and I'm going to get you involved in that. And but I just think the amount of people we can connect with doing that is going to be remarkable. And it's just one of those things. When you take, when you look at, you know, people always talk about the trades and, you know, you can make a good living in the trades and that. Yo, a lot of kids don't even think about when they first get started, they think about, oh, well maybe I should go to college, but I don't even know what I want to do. but you know, everyone, every young person, they want to make money. That's the big thing. So when the trades provide that a lot better than many, many, especially coming out of college, many Careers where, and, you know, after years by the trades, it starts off and you don't start off with that debt. But then one thing I think other people don't talk about too, is the level for advancement I was just thinking about it last night out of everyone I know who would be characterized as a millionaire, 90% of. We're trade workers who started their own companies, you know, so that's the way it should be presented to kids. Like when it's, Hey, you want to be a millionaire. Start this way. start become a plumber, become a five foot up coming in insulator become a tin knocker I guess, back to my leadership. Get these leadership skills, then start your own company. And that's the way so many people I know, you know, whether they be on big time firms. So I know guys who are just a five man electrical shop and they just make, make money, make money. Cause they just, they do the work. They work hard. They've got there, made the connections, has got their customers and keep at it. And I think. That's the end of it. Sometimes I think people forget to tell the kids that it's not just like, you're gonna, you have to be a plumber or an electrician working in the field, your whole life what'd you can, which is great. I mean, oh yeah. Hey I, everyone. I know who's retiring. Who's worked 30, 40 years in the trades there. They're retiring with plenty of. plenty of nest egg to go. So that's a, I mean, that's a great way to do it too. And they, some people like to work with their hands all the time, but there's just so many avenues you can go. And that's what I was thinking by getting people a lot more leadership experience, not just by hoping it happens. Is is going to be huge for, for people. And that just goes back. I'm thinking we were texting yesterday. I was talking with one of my customers from the installation and just going over it because I want to get him involved in doing the beta test into this. And he was just blown away. He said, you know, I got, I got a couple guys and one specifically, you know, he's a great journey. But he's doesn't know how he can make the jump to foreman he said, this is going to be great for him. And I was thinking, you know, even if it's just like that one guy Who gets helped out by this and makes that jump, you know, that's a big thing. And then, but then I think it, you know, it's not just that one guy there's people all over and then they can make that jump to be foreman. And maybe some of them may want to stay for them. And maybe some of them do something else. Maybe some of them won't start their own companies, but it's just how many lives. I think it starts to touch by, you know, getting, getting involved in doing something and not just kinda of like with a bad metal hanging around doing nothing. You, you, you get me fired up. I know one I'm grateful that you would even consider to include me in the thing. And reaching out. I love helping and it's clear to me that you're about it. But you mentioned. And Chris, Christopher Branch Lee, the law with rock the trades, I got to interview him the last conversation. And he said exactly what you said, like the career, the trades is a perfect, there's a pathway directly to starting your own damn business. And they make, you said millionaire, right? This, this person that's running five trucks out of his electrical shop. I bet every one of those trucks is turning over a hundred to $200,000. And all of that's come wrapping up into his business. it absolutely is that, and we, we need to do a better job of talking about that. Like the career pathways entering in is one thing. And then like the communication skills that you ended up building the relationships you ended up building and just like the straight up. What's the word like, like how man, you know, you learn the trade, you learn how to do things. You go to apprenticeship, they're going to teach you a, B, C, D the way things function. And then you're going to get out on the job and you got to make something happen. There's not a class for that, but you figure out how to make it happen. And you're faced with that every single damn day. And it's that skill of just working with what you've got in the moment and making it happen. That's the skill that people need to build their business. Oh yeah, exactly. That's the thing. It's wherever you resource are always limited by something and being able to work with work just gives people the parameters of, okay, these are my resources that I have. I have to make it work with this, you know, of course you'd go to the supply. I was getting more and it was other, you know, in business you could do the same thing. You know go to a bank at more money, do this, but regardless, when all is said and done, though, you still have to be able to work with what you have. And I think a lot of the planning aspects that are required and trades as well. I mean, if you're working on a job site, you have to stop getting, especially if you're a foreman, you have to start getting that planning aspect ahead, which is integral to running a business. Yeah, the business end. You can't just wait for, paperwork to come to you and then fill it out and hand it back. You've got to plan ahead every aspect of it, or, you know, you're not going to be in business anymore. So I think at data and two, it really is just getting out of the idea of planning and organizing people. People who work in the trades at a much better advantage to starting their own business as compared to someone who maybe very smart as well, but had a job where they would just do all the work for a company and not having to do all the planning and all. And the other thing that really excites me about your leadership program, that you're in development is one. You're doing it. Like we talked about it. It was an idea you already talking to people to beta tested with. So there's no doubt in my mind, you're going to make it happen. But the really, really exciting part about it is that it's being designed by a tradesman. For tradesmen like that is largely absent out there. Have you, in, in your prep for your program, have you come across any other types of content that is like designed by a craft worker? No, I don't think anything I've come across is designed to data end and even for. At the, the subcontractor business end of things too. I mean, that's just something that's often overlooked. And actually I was just jumped back when it was wasn't the lead builder and he actually talked about an insulator having to come and insulate the dock workers. Wow. Usually whenever any other like. You know, construction, treadmill, tariff that completely skip over the fact that as an insulator involved in the plumbing systems or HVAC systems, it's like they put the pipes in, then the walls are going up like, wait, wait, wait, they're missing that here. And it's so it's just that end of things. And then so much, you know, reading stuff about construction. It's generally geared towards everything out there is geared towards the general contractor and whether you're reading it, looking for information. So finding just anything that's geared towards subcontracting companies and personnel and field workers and everything, it's just slim to none. And that's another thing. It just by doing this and if it gets more people in our end of the industry thinking, oh, I have this experience here too. I can. Because there's, I don't know how many subcontractor firms, you know, in a. You know, construction trades there are across the country, but it's probably more than the It's just as so many people that, you know, the market for anything you do, or the people that can benefit and learn and be impacted by it. It was just enormous. It is man. It is, you know, I was talking to my friends Jennifer Lacy and Adam hoots, who we have. Regular call twice a week and to hold each other accountable and keep kind of brainstorming. And here this week, it felt like the theme of our conversations was about the type of people we surround ourselves with. And like you said, with, with social media, it's so easy to connect with people. And, and again, like you said, you reach out to so many people are willing to have. And now the other end of it is people it's very easy for them to reach out. And so I was explaining as like, you know, one of my filters is there are a lot of people that reach out and they'll message and Hey, let's connect. I think I can help. And for me, one really important thing. One, one really important attribute and you have one of them is that, that the individual wants to serve others. And when you and I started talking, it was clear. You weren't trying to make a million dollars. I mean, that may be the outcome, but you were trying to serve your people. You're trying to serve your organization. And then the, this idea of, of the leadership for trades again, you and I were texting and he said, man, they could just make a difference for one person. And that's what it's all about, man. So I applaud you for having that spirit of wanting to serve others because that's how we get there. Right? We are better together. And I feel like now there's this momentum with people are recognizing the trades and recognizing technology or, or social media is an amazing platform to continue to reach out and expand people's careers and help them experience this amazing side of the trades that very few people know about. Or do you think? Yeah, definitely. And just back to that, I was just thinking about how upsetting, again, back to the, you know, making a million dollars, whatever I make, whatever doing anything. It's just thinking that back to tradesmen and getting, if I had one guy that said, Hey, I, I did your leadership course. And then this happened, this happened, you know, five, 10 years down the road. And now I want to accompany company. I mean, like just how gratifying that would be to say, you know great successful company and it's just, it really impacted my life. And just, just like that sort of thing is would be so satisfying with it. And again, it's just something about the trays that often goes overlooked but even going to go, getting to what I'm doing now. I mean, I, year ago I would have been thinking like, yeah, I'm going to be started this Training program. And I was just thinking, okay, we're doing installation, doing an installation, but it just came to my experience like where we were at the company before, where it was a great successful company, but a lot of the people who we had left in the field I'm at some of them, we had a good mix of. And we had a, a chunk of older guys who were getting their retirement and they were our core crew. And I ensure there's a way with a lot of contracting firms. And when those guys go, is that experience that they have that. Can be lost. I mean, some of it gets passed down, but really making it intentional to get that experience from these guys who have been, we've done it for 30 years, 25 years or more 3,500. And get it to the younger guys and make sure it doesn't just leave it up to chance that the younger guys pick this up. And because everyone's so busy in the trades, you know, it's, you know, you're on a job site. You know, when I do my rounds to the site, sometimes I'll be okay, wait, we're in great shape here with a wide open hallway for us to, or wide open for, for us to insulate pipes and duct work . I go back three days later, this days, does the foreman take time to talk to, you know, his younger journeyman and say, okay, so this is how we sit down and make a plan. It's like, no, we gotta get going. And, and it's good at that. It teaches people the urgency of things, but it also just doesn't leave that time. Or even a lot of people to stop and think that we got to make sure that this happens, you know, and then at the business and it's phone calls about, Hey where I w we got walls going up tomorrow, or we're gonna have a test on all of this pipe or, or at the fitters. Hey, we need to get the pipes in before the walls. So there's not everyone doesn't stop and get the chance to think about what do we do to make sure we are not always in survival mode? We're not always like a rabbit on the wheel. How do we get these? How do we get the younger guys? Learn, make sure they'll learn. Cause they all learn a lot, but it's just that intentional learning from the experienced guys and ma and sometimes even getting the experience guys brushed up on some skills and getting a new perspective into things. Jump back a little bit again where we were in the company before, and then, then I'm looking at a company now that is a much larger company, but the same track it's yup, yup. A lot of the, a lot of the more experienced guys you know, again, five to seven years out of retirement and I'm looking at well, we've got to make sure that this starts happening and that's where the whole thing stemmed from at my end. And just, you know, the fact that we don't even have enough foreman to handle the Monica construction. That's going on up in the Northeast right now. Yeah. It's still, it's still booming up here and just really starting to get that knowledge across. Yeah, man. No, I think, you know, the, there's been a lot of. Stuff on TV and whatever about the great, the great resignation. And it's my theory. Like people ain't quitting and just sitting at home. What I think is happening is people are quitting and going to find work with people, with organizations that are prepared to invest and develop. And I think where your headed is it that's all I'm hearing is you're re you're gearing up to invest and develop your people to show appreciation for them. And also the business sense is, Hey, they're leaving. We need to start building our people up You know, it's tough, you nailed it, right. Everything's a hundred miles an hour. You don't really get to say, Hey, time out, give me an extra day. So I can wrap this duct behind right next to the firewall. You get it, or you don't, and then you're climbing all over the damn thing. So we don't necessarily have that time built in but organizations can be to use your language intentional and say, wait a minute, let's do something to help build new skillsets within our folks so that we can. Handle those situations when they happen, as opposed to like, well, that's just the way it is because that ain't going to get us nowhere. No, exactly. And even coming up to those situations to you know, I have experienced people say, well, that's the way it is. And it's just getting worse. And and that kind of tied into what I was thinking about going back to a lot of the lean principles and that we spoke about it. Well, it doesn't need to be that way. There's no reason. There's no reason to show it has to go in when you know, two months ahead of time when when pipes aren't up yet or installation's not up yet, but it's again, it's just I think a data and two, it's a lot of general contractors again, moving at a hundred miles per hour and they have. The superintendents and the project managers and everyone who aren't as experienced and don't know how to organize people and basically some of the way so their, their solution to try to make things happen happened faster. Okay. Let's just have things happen faster, but so people tell him we're going to be put that, put the ceiling up and all it does is ends up slowing everything down. Yeah. Yeah. You know, the, the pipe goes up, you know, half as fast or slower. And then, you know, where the same way at all, random, you know, cause then the cost, the next, the next area is then falls behind more. And then, well, we need more people here. There aren't any more people everyone's working everywhere. so it just ends up in this vicious cycle. So like that's another aspect of leadership having the guys in the field, they're the ones who see this and they need to learn explain, Hey, it's gonna take me two days to get down this hall. Hold the ceiling guy off for two days, it's going to speed your project up dramatically. Cause if I, if I, if that goes up, then I'm going to be a week and a half in this hallway, and then we're going to be the same that we're going to be further behind on the next item. And really just people having people stop having that mentality of accepting that. Okay, the ceiling's going up. Yeah, we're going to take a week and a half. And then the job's gonna just get worse, but really just teach people. No, you don't have to accept that. I mean, there's still things people can do that are gonna make your life more difficult, but just by getting rid of the idea that we're going to accept that and okay, we've got to go talk to someone. You know, try to make a plan together. That's a big, that's a big skill to have. And that just ties in a lot of the lean building concepts. I mean, I know the lean doing goes a lot more further than that, but ties on all of that in with leadership as well. And basically the communication skills that unnecessary and not yelling at not going and yelling at the ceiling di You're screwing me over. Cause that's a good anywhere, but you know that, I mean, it's stressful high pressure environments. That's how it comes out so fast. And just even just teaching people. The communication skills, how to get that guy to listen and have a little empathy or understanding of your situation and in a light that he can understand that, how it affects his situation to not just sound like. Coming across as someone was complaining or someone was looking for a favor, but really just connecting like two human beings. That's it? You know, and who aren't an opposing force because let's face it. Everyone in the who's doing the building, a building, they're all doing it. They're all on the same. They all have the same goal to get this building built for. Whoever's gonna end up occupying of the school or the hospital and providing mean it should be. I look at it. The whole construction project should be working together to provide as much value to the end customer as possible. So whoever's going to be occupied or ordering the building and it doesn't always happen that way on the job sites. It's, there's so much. Yeah, so much conflict and people will think, and I've been on, we've been on sites where it does work that way. That's great. And you know, the, the, the, the sealant guy or the carpenter or the GS, they're not looking at the sub-trades as the enemy, but certain, certain GCs we work for as soon as the substance on steps on the job. Somehow they're the enemy we're working, we're working to help you complete your task so you can deliver a good final product to your customer. The people who are paying a hundred million dollars for something, you know, it's when you start really thinking about it. what buildings can cost a hundred, 200 million. And if you're paying 200 million or a hundred million, or even $10 million or something, do you want it something that people are cutting corners on because that they weren't coordinating with each other. And that's a big thing. No, you wouldn't, you wouldn't want to say you wouldn't want to think, well, all those pipes may not be insulated or, you know maybe they didn't get a test on the pipes that are in the rise is because the wall needed to go up or the GC want to put the wall up a little quicker. No, you'd want to you'd think it paying $10 million or a hundred billion dollars, something you'll get an a $10 million, a hundred million dollar product, you know? And I think people forget that sometimes. Yeah. Yeah. I think you said it beautifully, right? We're all here to build the same building together. We're all one team and we can do it together or we can fight and scream and cuss all the way down to the damn finish line. And the reality is like the trade, the craft workers, once the trades get onsite, they're the answer, they're the solution. But we too often and it's getting better, but it's still out. Too often we're treated like we're the problem. And really man, if, if, if we just honor and respect the men and women that are doing the work, your army to build this damn building gets bigger. But if you want to put them against each other and have everybody fighting, your army is a, it's a number of what, like how many, when you're out on a project I've seen general contractor teams of two to 3:00 PM. And there's hundreds of craft workers. Like you can't take on all hundred. No, I know friends. We can, we can really make something happen together. Yeah. Yeah. But when they get in the situation where they stop pitting everyone against each other, then like, how does this help and does it. So I think at many ends that's getting better and but some NS find it's getting worse just because people. Again, project managers and supers for GCs sometimes don't have they experienced. No, they're not, they don't want to do it maliciously, but they don't know how to stop that from happening. They just kind of let it go and they don't have the experience thing. No, it doesn't have to be this way. We can, we can do a little bit better. And so it's kind of one of those things I just want to get across in this course that I'm producing. And just those communication skills that, Hey, if it makes 10% of construction workers, jobs, 10% easier, you know what I mean? It's a miracle really think like even, even if 1% made 1% of workers jobs, 5% easier. It's hard work everyone's doing out there. If you can just cut a little bit out from the, just by improving communication skills and getting rid of these things that you know, everyone doesn't have to do because there wasn't good communication somewhere. And that's just gotta be, would just be huge, you know, a hundred percent. You insulator started your career early leading crews. You're up on the other side of the business now, estimating coordinating, planning, developing leadership programs. And this is all again, I'm going to say this for the L and M family out there. And for other folks that are listening, like the path is wide open and you're going to make. Amazing. And anybody that comes into the trades has the same, that opportunity exists for all of us to, to make these life changes. That help impact the lives of other people. Like that's what it's all about. So you started your career. What else should the L and M family know about you, Brad? Well, I, to stop my career, I didn't stop my career in the field. I started more warehousing and deliveries and that, and the real dirty end of the real dirty end of things. maybe jumped back to what I wish I knew starting off and is that you don't need to know everything or seem like, you know it because it's one of those things. People think everyone else, or they'll think someone else knows everything. And then when you really start to know it, let's talk about. they don't know any more about this than I do, so I shouldn't feel embarrassed about it, but I think everyone goes at whole life and they'll be afraid to say something. And I was like that a lot when I was younger and not knowing something like, okay, I'll just maybe I'll want to figure it out tomorrow, whether he was talking about, but the guy was telling you something, he may not know either. So. Well, what is this we're doing? Oh, we got to figure it out. And it's like, after I realized that so many times, and that sort of thing has happened where two people probably think each other, the other knows what what's going on or what something is, but, and they're both kind of afraid to say it, but really just getting that openness. Yeah. And so just learning how to develop that in yourself. Well but as far as like, what you know, what, what should people know about? I mean, I'm just. Continually trying to learn and develop myself and become better and more impactful. And it's just something that I think anyone can do you know, continue challenging yourself and, you know, that's why I like to do, I, I if I didn't have some sort of challenge I think I would start climbing up the walls and go crazy because yeah. But it just makes, makes it makes life a little bit more meaningful when you find some sort of challenge and and go through with it. I've had that lesson that you talked about. It's an amazing lesson in it. It's it's so simple. Well, most people are just trying to figure it out, right? Like they, I think they know right. At all levels of any organization, regardless of they have a billion dollars of backlog or $10 million of backlog saying everybody's there just making the best decision they can with the information and the resources that they have at hand all the time. And I think. Having the courage to tell another human being like, bro, I don't really know either. Like let's just figure this thing out. Like that's when the magic starts happening mentally it's played out for me anyway. Yeah, really. And that's but that's, I think just the toughest thing and you know, sometimes it'd be a confidence thing or sometimes some people can be an ego thing, but. Regardless, everyone's in that situation at some point. And usually I have tons of points in their life where they just completely confused by something, what is going on here and, you know, bringing it up and by bringing it up, you may all of a sudden open up, open the eyes of 10 people around you in the same boat. And. And like I said before, even the person who was first presented it, he could be in a safe. Yup. Yup. 100%, man. A lot of times the teacher or the facilitator is just two pages ahead of the class. And I know them because I've had the facilitate classes and I'm like, oh man, I hope they don't ask real heavy questions. I didn't read the whole book yet. Oh man. So, okay, good. Perfect segue into the, the big question. You've got a lot of experience. It seems like you're investing your time, always facing, taking on a new challenge for yourself and now wanting to contribute and support people, help people build their careers out there. So over your years, wherever in the business place onsite and the warehouse and home. What is, what is a significant learning that you had as a result of a painful misstep? Ooh there's quite a few to go over there. All right. Y'all we got a bit of a change here. Yes. I'm breaking up the flow and that's not going to change. It's going to stay the same, but the L and M family has spoken out and we've heard you loud and clear. What we are doing is the backstage passes. These clips that you're not going to be able to listen to on this audio version are now going to be available to everybody. On our YouTube channel. So head up our YouTube channel, subscribe, follow, like hit all the buttons and, and give yourself a little bit of a. Uh, learnings and missteps marathon and catch up on all the outtakes. We want to hear your comments and we want to know what you're learning from these things, because all of our guests have shared some pretty intimate, uh, missteps and have had some pretty profound learnings. And we hope that you can take that and apply that going forward and even teach it to your people, the people you care about. So, That is going to be the deal going forward. Thank you for supporting us and back to the show. Real lessons that everybody deals with. I mean, and like, you know, it's easy to think that those kinds of things happen only in the professional space, but they happen at home too. They happen with the girlfriend or the wife or the brothers. And like, just, just say it, just get it out there and take it all in, man. I believe it's kind of, you've mentioned THe Lean Builder and one of the things that I think a lot of people miss and in this lean methodology is there's a lot of tools and there's a lot of really cool stuff that people can start doing and put into place to remove waste and this sort of thing. But in that, like for me, the spirit of it is the improvement and you improve. For me anyways, I improve through experimentation. I have an idea. I'm going to try something, see if it works. If it doesn't work, I'm going to adjust it. Right. That's the PDCA cycle, which all sounds really groovy. I always thought it's beautiful. We're going to save time and save labor and Wawa. But the real truth is that spirit does not exist unless the leader. Is prepared to learn about the problems you got to create an environment or the conditions where your people have the confidence, or maybe not even confidence. You got to create the space so that they know they're not going to get their head bit off when they come and tell you there's a problem. And man, I'm going to tell you when I like over the years of my career's grown or I have more responsibility and more influence early on, man, people would, would bring a problem to me. And I didn't even have to say, like I was trying to mind my words and not cost and scream and yell because we got a really bad situation, but they saw it in my face. And when they could see me freaking. Guess what that told them. Don't tell Jesse about the problem because he's going to freak out. So it took a lot of practice for me to like, okay, well go, what are we thinking? How should we approach it? All right. Yeah, let me go get that stuff. Or I'll bring down to the person and let's make that happen. And as soon as I jumped in my truck, man, I was screaming and cussing and yelling, but it was again, the most, I think the most important part is creating that the conditions such that people view. Safe to bring problems to the leadership. What do you think about that? And that I think is even, like you said, when you're able to control and act like a person who's able to make it safe for someone. And everything else from when you stop growing up is so directed towards you do something wrong. There's a punishment, you know, you screw up on a test in school, you get, you get a bad grade and and, and then you go home and you got it, got a bad report card and it's, there's. There's not so really trying to break people of that habit. Understand it. Doesn't I mean, that's a big thing. It's not little. And so even if they could say, okay, I know I could always talk to Jesse. It's they still gonna have in the back of their mind? Oh, I screwed up. I can't tell an authority figure or a supervisor or someone above in the, you know, in the hierarchy of things. Or when I do, it's going to be bad, even if it's not even, you got a complete understanding. It's so it's really, that's a big thing is helping them understand that really our whole lives we've kind of been conditioned away from this experimentation or even a not experiment, but. That, whatever we do wrong is going to have a repercussion when it doesn't always have to you know, people make mistakes and a lot of mistakes are good to make. You don't want to make one where someone's gonna get injured or, you know, Excessively financially a disastrous, you know, but the thing is, you know, like crap, I lost a million dollars. How do we how do I, how do I tell Jesse? I just lost a million dollars on that project today. but it was one of those things. People in positions of, you know, hierarchical, hierarchical leadership need to be able to really get people comfortable, more comfortable than they think they would have to, because of that experience everyone's had growing up in schools at home and this and that, and kind of breaking the old mold of the way we think about things. Yes. Oh man. I'm excited about this leadership program. You're going to be putting together cause I'm pretty damn sure that's going to be an element in it. Right? Like how do we create the conditions to combat all of the conditioning that we've had about problems? You know, one of the things I used to do when I was like helping develop a new foreman and they were really nervous about ordering material, like, well, what if our especially duct fabrication shop that we would send our orders in, you know and usually that was handled by our VDC group where they, you know, they draw it up coordinated and then it just pump it out. But every so often we'd have to do site orders, right. Just because of whatever things didn't work out. And, and, and it's very easy to screw it up and like, look, I know it's hard, man. I know what you're feeling. Let me just. I made the very first duct order. I made it with some transfer duck some lined duck that was Trent, you know, transferring from one room to the other. I got my dimensions flipped. So what ended up happening was I got to trailer. Full of duct went straight from the trailer into the dumpster. Like, like I said, the guys called me, they suggest what? Like, what are they saying? Wrong stuff. I looked at it, they sent me a picture of like, oh man, I flipped the damn. What did he do? Got it. And know it, it was big. It was like 62 by 24, instead of, yeah. Disaster. When I say, bro, go ahead and talk to the GC. Let them know if they can bring another dumpster out right now, because we're about to fill it up with. And it was, you know, when I have, when I made the mistake, I had to call my boss. I said, Hey man. And he said, Sean, a bug. I said, yeah, man, it's a 20, $30,000 mistake. But sharing that with the guys while they, it was their first time, they're like really like, yeah, bro. Like I made some pretty damn expensive mistakes in my life. I'm not saying. I'm saying it it's part of the learning. Right? Exactly. And that's the thing about being a potential you were with them and being able to admit to them, you could have said, you know, so you're at data now you can let them do it and then have him make the same mistake. But then it's like you making this mistake twice for not admitting it. You're not telling them about it, but now they've learned from your experience. Double check those. And you know, if it happens to happen, but still at least you're not making the same mistake twice, because imagine if, when he ordered a bunch of transcripts, I called somebody like crap. This is like 15 years ago when I did it all over again, it was what you said. I say, dude, make your list and send it to me. I'll double check it like that. That was, that was. And that's what I didn't do the first time. I didn't ask somebody that had the experience to double check my work. I just, you know, it didn't take much. And to your point, I didn't have to repeat that mistake after that, I was like, oh, I'm afraid of ordering duck, man. Like, that's not my strength. Let me get somebody got the expertise there. Oh, good stuff. Okay. Well we're coming up to the end. And I love, this is my favorite question to ask. And I think it's the least favorite question of everybody that we've had on the show so far. But here's the question. What footprint do you want to leave on this world? I mean, it goes back to leaving an impact to helping people, but. Really just there being people who I may not know about who, if I were gone, they see my obituary and say, oh yeah, maybe someone I haven't met. And it's funny. Yeah, I used to do a lot of lifting. I was the competitive strong man for a while and power lifting and I did one body building competition a few years ago and it's there were people, you know, and I w I was huge at one point in time. And you know, not like nationwide, you post pictures on Instagram, like this dude's a beast. Yeah. So well, you know, there'd be guys who are in the gym. Yeah, I'd be working on lifting whatever I'm lifting training for a competition and you know, some young guy doing something and I'm saying something nice to him and give him a little, little tip and, not seeing the guy ever again. And then he maybe like five years later Hey your breath. Yeah. Hey, you know, you said this to me, this, and it you know, made a big impact in my, at my lifted it. And I got these over these barriers and, and just like that sort of thing. Like sometimes I wouldn't even remember, or, you know, I had a break, but somewhere else does for years and just leaving that so impacted on a larger scale. So whether it be, you know, this leadership course or something else I got involved in later on. Having that impact if so-and-so had obituary, when I die and saying, oh yeah, that's that guy, you know, I heard him say, I heard him say this and this on, on Jesse Hernandez podcast on the L and pod. And it affected me. It impacted my life. Well, so I, I watches leadership course. I started my own company or or whatever else I may get involved in, in the future you know, saw or heard something that I said, or someone who I didn't meet, but somehow just impacted them and that they had removed. In the future. I think that's kind of like a really good sign of being able to impact, to help someone that has no way of really coming back and doing something for me, but just, it just happens. And not that I even know about it or anything but that that they know about it, that I think that'd be the big, the footprint I'd want. Man, that's amazing. But what I'm hearing is service to others, ripples of impact. Like you, it's clear to me that you are taking responsibility for the gifts and talents that you have, and you want to apply them and share them such that it impacts and improves someone else's life. And you don't even need to know who they are. You don't even know. You just want to leave. For people to continue to serve. That's amazing bread. Oh, thank you, Jay. So there you have it, Mr. Brad Anderson, insulator leader, entrepreneur, super humble down to earth guy, and don't mess with them because he's a beast you got to check them out on Instagram. That dude is be looking forward to continue working with him and see the impact, like kind of his vision, right? Like. Jennifer Lacy talks about the ripples of impact all the time and what he was describing as those ripples that we can't see. They go beyond our inner and outer circle and continue to affect people out there in the world. And that's what it's all about. Those are the type of people that we got out there in the trades, and those are the folks that we want to be celebrating. So shake a trades person's hand, and we got to give the shout out to the LNM family member. That's hooking us up with some feedback. And this one goes to Mr. Thomas Lamay and this one, this one was kind of special. And I'm also cheating a little bit because I heard somewhere that Thomas Lamay is going to be doing some collabo sessions. So more to come on that. But Thomas shared with us, his favorite episode was the PPC conversation with. You said it was like chicken noodle soup for the soul. Uh, and what he finds the most valuable is the real conversations with real people about real stuff. Thomas, that means a lot because I am super self-conscious about being gimmicky and being salesy and being, you know, just slimy. And to get that feedback from you, man really means a lot to me. It, it pumps me up. It gives me courage to continue forward. And I thank you for leading the way that you lead at rest of the L and M family keep being awesome because people are watching you and you're setting the example. You're treating people the way they need to be treated the way they deserve to be treated. And that's what we're all about. Thank you again. And we've got another one coming in a couple of weeks, please. Man you are one dedicated listener, sticking with us all the way through to the very, very, and please know that this podcast dies without you. And we invite you to share how the episodes impacting you along with your thoughts, questions, and suggestions. You have been gracious with your time. So we added social media links in the show notes to make it super easy for you to connect with. Be kind to yourself. Stay cool. And we'll talk at you next time..