Leadership Tachycardia and the Power of Recovery with Hanna Bauer

Cold Open And Meeting Hannah

SPEAKER_00 0:00

I got to a point where I was completely exhausted and depleted. And I had grit, right? I mean, I had passion. I believed in what I did. And I still couldn't do the thing.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

What is going on, LM family, back again? And this time, this is a little bit unique because our guest today, I've had zero communication with her beforehand. So if I seem extra curious, it's because I am. I'm super excited. I did some stalking. Of course, y'all know I went and looked at her LinkedIn and her YouTube and everything to learn as much as I could. And here's what you need to be excited about. She helps leaders lead with hope, empowerment, accountability, results, and trust. And there is a lot there. So we're going to try to keep this to a less than six-hour interview because you know how excited I am about those topics. Her name is Miss Hannah Bauer. She's a powerhouse. I'm jealous. I was looking at your YouTube channel and all the Sizzle clips. Yeah, I was like, man, I need some of that. Those are fantastic. So, folks, after you listen to our conversation, go check out her YouTube channel. But we're gonna learn more about Miss Hannah here in a second. Now, if this is your first time here, you're listening to the Learn Inns and Missteps podcast, where you get to see firsthand, front row seat, how amazing human beings just like you are sharing their gifts and talents to leave this world better than they found it. I'm Jesse, your selfish servant, and we are about to get to know Miss Hannah. Miss Hannah, how are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:45

Oh, I'm doing awesome, Jesse. Thanks so much for your invite and having me here today.

SPEAKER_02 1:50

Oh, you're you're welcome. Again, I I super applaud the courage it takes to schedule an interview with some stranger, especially a wacko like me, because you never know where I'm gonna go. And so, should we start off kind of like warm up in the conversation?

SPEAKER_00 2:06

However, you like it. I like it authentic. I like it how you say the organic part. So I'm all for it. I love it.

Empowerment Starts With A Full Cup

SPEAKER_02 2:12

Good, good. Okay, we'll start with an easy question. What's empowerment? What is empowerment? People say it all the time, I hear it a lot, but what is it?

SPEAKER_00 2:24

Well, for me, empowerment is it starts just with the whole basic part. Actually, it came. Um, I didn't understand it until it was like you cannot give what you don't have. Uh, and for me, empowerment was that is actually making sure that I have that my cup stays full, remains full, especially when I give it, because you can't empower. And this is a hard lesson I learned in leadership. Wanting to empower and serve everybody, but I was not taking care of me. So empowerment really looks at that, it's keeping my cup full, really wanting the overflow, right? Which comes with fulfillment. Um, but that's the one, making sure that my cup is full is empowerment.

SPEAKER_02 3:00

I love okay. So you this is good. Making sure your cup's full, right? We've heard the stuff you can't pour from an empty cup, take care of you, so you can take care of others. And you just said, like, you've been through it where you weren't taking care of yourself, yeah. And you're not the only human being that does that. So I'd like to get your thoughts. Maybe for you, what was it that helped you realize? Like, okay, I can't keep doing this, I really need to take care of myself. What brought you to that point? And how did you get comfortable with it? Because knowing it and then getting comfortable with it are very, very different things.

SPEAKER_00 3:39

Oh my gosh, Jesse, I think that's a lesson I continuously learn. You know, like oh my god, I became continuous improvement for a reason. I'm continually improving in that area. And I think that's one of the parts, right? Um, I think with doing that with what you need, you also have to be mindful of the times. There the times and really the exertion that certain activities need, right? So there's times where I have to be very creative. So although I may not be physically doing a lot of stuff, it still is very draining. And I have to understand when I'm having those times where I'm gonna be creative, it I need to also allow that same amount of time, if not more, and recovery, and it looks different. So I think that was the first realization is how did I realize that when I was consistently feeling stuck, stuck in different things, you know, like you just like you know that you can do it, you know you have the desire to do it. You may even have what you think is perhaps even the energy to do it, because like there's no reason, like I actually rested, I have my sleep and all this stuff, and it's just didn't happen. So I started looking at the reasons why I was stuck. And sometimes it was because of things, right? That were draining, sometimes it was because I wanted to do creative things, sometimes because like all the list of things I had to do, the overwhelm, all of those parts, and I realized that those were signals that were telling me, hey, you're not filling up your cup, you're not keeping being empowered. So realizing that there were different things that drain at different times, I particularly became aware of this, painfully aware, well, with motherhood, and being an entrepreneur bleedy, right? I got to a point where I was completely exhausted and depleted, and I had grit, right? I mean, I had passion, I believed in what I did, and I still couldn't do the thing. And then I started realizing this felt this reminded me just like how I felt when I was a kid, when I had I was battling heart disease. And yeah, and what was happening, heart disease. Well, it was when your heart's not beating right, when blood's not flowing correctly, when everything was feeling foggy, because the breath itself was just not going in. And I realized that not taking care, not taking the time to breathe, even in my leadership and my parenting in the things that I did were actually getting in the way of me being and doing and having all that I wanted to do.

SPEAKER_02 6:00

Oh my goodness. Okay, thank you. Because we just kind of keep opening the cans of worms, and there's good stuff there. Taking the time to breathe. I think I love that you said that. I think it's a powerful anchor or message that people can take from this conversation. So, LM Foundy Member, write that one down. Take time to breathe. Now, which sounds simple. Now, anybody that's done any kind of meditation or breathing breathing practices, like it's there's a difference between just kind of letting your body automatically breathe and then being intentional intentional about giving yourself space to breathe. So a little weird question, or maybe you could tell me, Hannah, like if I'm weird, just a psychopath. Where I find that I need to create a buffer or space to breathe, is after I've had a really amazing experience. Meaning I had to limit the amount of people and things I was gonna be involved in after a big that I've been working on and planning for a long time, and then I finally executed. Because after that, it was great, but I would make bad decisions, I would get ill, my immune system would crash, all this weird stuff would that sound am I the only one?

SPEAKER_00 7:22

No, I don't think you're the only one. I mean, because sometimes when we are in that moment and you over-exert yourself and you don't realize you've been actually taking out of your reserves, although it's something that you loved, although you were getting that fulfillment and like in a sense that dopamine, right? Like you're going and really it takes a hold of everything, especially because we take on so much. Sometimes it's like that passion, right? Like, hey, you uh the desire to do the thing really takes a toll. Putting that time for restorant restoring that restoration time after a high is a big deal. What was really good too is in the middle of it, right? Like being mindful so that we don't get to places like that. Something I'm still learning because it's like, no, this has to get done. This, you know, this is like okay, we just one more, one less push, one less push, one less push, and then then there is a crash.

Breath Burnout And Leadership Tachycardia

SPEAKER_02 8:15

Oh, yeah, I super appreciate you being like vulnerable and transparent about the realities of that, right? Passionate people that really care and have a mission and a calling. It's very easy for us to chase after that 100 miles an hour and run ourselves ragged. But you help leaders and executives like manage themselves. Am I wrong?

SPEAKER_00 8:38

Oh no, that's absolutely right. Um, I especially, you know, because we the whole question with purpose comes in here, right? And sometimes we we confuse purpose with passion. And passion is an emotion, right? I mean, it's something that a whole emotional high sometimes we're like, oh, you know, if I have that passion, then it means I'm on purpose. But you can see how emotion being like this, like that, like this, like that, it'll be very difficult to base an entire am I on purpose or not on an emotion. So one of the ways that I work with leaders is that I mean, it's like not only like the emotional part that definitely when you're on purpose, you'll feel good, there's fulfillment. Um, but also looking at the roles um that are coming into play with that, and overall the mission that you have. So something that um, and I've dealt with a lot of great, amazing leaders that have big visionaries, but are worn out, are burned out, and there's like nothing left. I mean, even like illness, and and I've been there. I mean, I one there was one point where I was actually executive director of a nonprofit. I also was being CEO of uh my business and also like wanting to serve a mom of four at that time. So yeah, but hey, I was passionate, I was getting it done, right? I mean, this is a good work, good work must get done. The problem is I was suffering from leadership tachycardia in essence, because it was like I get like I did with my heart, because it goes fast, fast, fast, fast, fast, fast. Well, it's not sustainable, right? So when you can be going in, and even if you think about it, when you run and when you're in on tachycardia, which is needed at times because that's why you know when you're exercising, you need your heart to go fast, you will your breathing adjusts to that. So you can adjust, but there's also a time when you're bringing it down. And if you don't know, it takes just as much skill as to race up your heart, which takes a lot of strain, and it also takes skill to bring it down. Now, think about that collectively with an organization. What happens a lot with leaders as well, and you know, we'll we gotta help our people also bring it down so that we can perform not all the time, we gotta perform at the right times.

Seasons Guilt And Letting Go

SPEAKER_02 10:50

Yes. We're going to do the LM Family Member Shout out, and this one goes to Mr. Xavier Ross. Mr. took the time to leave a little review on the Google, and he says, Jesse does a great job facilitating much needed conversations and training our teams to take a good look at the problems at hand. Xavier, I appreciate you, my brother. We had a session just today, this morning, and and we had some real talk. And he brought he brought the game and we made some progress. And so, folks out there in the Omniverse LM family members, you already know. I love it when you give me attention, when you give our guests some love and tender love and care. And so any comments you make, the stars, the recommendations, the shares, etc., deeply, deeply appreciated. And when you leave a comment, it gives me the opportunity to celebrate you in the future. So please do that. Oh my goodness. I I love that you pointing out the leadership tachycardia, like for real, because we're doing this, and if we're here all the time, it's not sustainable. Now, I'm a recovering, right? Like I used to be 100 miles an hour all the time, and I had like a four to six week burnout cycle. Every four to six years ago, I would get sick, I hated people, I don't want to talk to anybody, just leave me alone. Right? And then I'm back and I'm ready to go. And then it was it was just over and over and over. Luckily, I had a a boss that pointed that out to me. Now, but I also recognized so it was very difficult for me to come to terms with the idea of taking care of myself, journaling, exercising, slowing down, taking time off. Like that's stupid. We got work to do. That was my mentality, and so I had to get over that and you know, really invest in myself. So I'm an advocate for self-care. And I also know maybe I'm wrong, that there is a season to go a hundred miles an hour. Absolutely. Season or multiple seasons, and there's a season to pause and and again take a breath.

unknown 13:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:13

Do you agree or am I?

SPEAKER_00 13:15

Oh 100%. Yeah, no, it's that, and I think that that's again, that's that's the art and the beauty in leadership, the knowing the times. But again, there's times where you gotta go 100%. I mean, you think about just let's think about a profession like accountants, right? This is their due time. Like it's not like all this stuff, you know, like, hey, we're gonna take our time. No, this is like due, or people could end up in jail. Like, right? So you they know this is due time, but what happens? A lot of them have that time of rest. Like when you come May, come June, come July, it's like complete that, you know, part. So you see, even like in professions, there's always cycles. Um, you see that in tourism, you see that in parts. So, as a leader, it's understanding in your business, in your organization. Um, I know, for example, I uh like last year, my one of my sons was graduating. I knew that Tom was going to be busy, not only busy with stuff, but it was gonna be emotionally draining too. You know, the new things that's all this part. So I purposely, and let me tell you, it was hard to be intentional about resting because, like, oh no, I can't do this. Or this is the temptation. So, absolutely the times, this seasons, not only the times in the the rhythm of the organization, but also in the seasons where we're at. Like I said, I mean, I have five kids, so I had a baby since my last boy, so I have a five-year-old. But I also gotta know back when they were all little and I had three in diapers, my entrepreneurship looked a bit different. The way I the way that I worked, looked different in the way I do now. Um, now they have driver's licenses, now I worry in a different way. I don't have to be worried about changing diapers, I'm always worried like they're gonna be okay in the street, you know. So we we trade, but uh needless to say, there's different ways that I arrange my schedule, the way that that things do. So again, it's being mindful, and because I I did fall into that guilt. I fell into that guilt. Oh, I'm not doing what I was doing then. I need to get back to that now. And it was constantly this guilt of as a professional, what I should be doing as a professional, or later on, it was that guilt as a parent, all these things of me trying to please all these ideas that I had of something that may have been at one time, without looking at where am I currently and where am I going. And rest is associated with that.

SPEAKER_02 15:35

My goodness. Okay, so there's a couple of things I want to get into on this the guilt. Well, we'll come back to I'm gonna come back to that. What I'm curious because I mean, mother of five entrepreneur running a business, you got you're no slacker. So what and and a lot of the LM family members out there are the same, they've got a lot of things going on, they're committed to doing, they know that they should take care of themselves like tomorrow, mañana. We'll do it tomorrow, maybe not today. What ad what would you tell leaders that are still not embracing the idea of taking that breath, of taking care of themselves? What advice practice would you give them to say, hey, hello, hello, try this? Any thoughts?

SPEAKER_00 16:21

Oh, yeah, it's vital. Um, the breath is vital that I learned that not only as a going through a very heart disease, but just in life, understanding your rhythm is huge. Understanding also, you know, the the in being okay with that. But I think a lot of times it's it's also the the culture or or this this pressure that we have from the outside many times that it's even like made-up pressure that doesn't even exist. The ideas that we have, and I think a lot of times that happens with leaders. I know that's happened with me. You may you might see something on a social media and you see, oh, so-and-so is doing that, and I should be doing that too. Or how do I get there? Or I'm so behind. So, all of these comparison points that we have, and and I believe it's very important to have that spirit, adopt that spirit of excellence versus a spirit of perfection. Because what we get stuck is what with our idea of what perfection is, you know, like the ideal of what my day looks like in the moment that it doesn't, I'm gonna spend the rest of the time making up for whatever it is my idea was, and it's like this never-ending cycle. Uh, and I mean, and honestly, there were times even as recent, like last year, for example, my word of the year was to abide, and that meant for me rest, and it was hard, it was so hard for me, like to be okay in the rest. And that didn't mean like I was just out vacay all the time, not at all. It meant for me that resting in the work, you know, taking ownership of the things I could do, but letting go of the outcome, and I realized that I so much of my energy was going to try to control an outcome that I couldn't control. I that was this completely out of my control. I really have now uh any energy I spent on that was stealing my joy, was stealing my rest, was stealing so many things. And when I needed to concentrate in how do I do this tactic, how do I do it better, how do I do it more efficient, and then rest in the outcome, rest in the knowing that it's done with excellence, rest in knowing that hey, it's gonna come to me and put in priorities first. I think in rest that becomes a lot of too is understanding that priority is priority. I sat down for six years, I couldn't operate the same way, the way I was doing my business or even speaking. I I had to change, didn't make me any less, didn't change my purpose, didn't change those things, it just looked different for that season and being okay with that.

SPEAKER_02 18:55

Oh my god, so so powerful. So coming back to the idea of pleasing external expectations, outside pressure, because most of the people I get to interact with, and I'm one of those people, most of the stress, irritation, fear, anxiety, whatever you need to call it, right? Pressure is fabricated, it's imaginary. I'm creating it in my head because I'm allowing to external expectations, assumptions that I have about what other people expect from me. And so I need to do that, like you said, right? Oh, I saw something on freaking TikTok. I need to start doing TikTok dances, and then I got all these other like it's just oh. And the reality is like nobody asks for that, nobody cares, nobody's judging. It's going to be fine, right? Like, it's gonna be fine, and so around the idea of fulfilling external expectations that haven't been communicated, meaning nobody told you that. You're assuming, or we are assuming that they expect that. What are your thoughts there?

Facts Versus The Story You Tell

SPEAKER_00 20:11

I think that goes with like what's the story we're telling ourselves about the situation that we're in. I mean, sometimes, yeah, there I've had times on my bank account, it's just it's the fact I'm like, oh my gosh, I need to be doing this, and it but then I make up a story that goes along with that. And the story may not match the real thing, and really what's causing the pressure is the story that I tell myself about while my bank account looks or doesn't look the way I want it to look. So I think a lot of it comes up with that is what I was the story I'm telling myself because we can't change the facts. I mean, there's certain things like that, it it's it's a fact. Yeah, it's not either not happening or oh my gosh, this is happening. So, but what's the story is what's draining and what when you talk about the judgmental aspect and you know, all of these imaginary things that had nothing to do with that, like absolutely nothing to do with it. But now the story becomes the leading reason for why I do what I do instead of like dealing with the fact, and I think that's very important with what we're doing is separating the facts, which we have to do as in leaders. One of the first things that we have to do is really define reality. We gotta define that reality now, but then also what is the story that we're telling ourselves with that? That has to come into check. That's where a lot of the external things come into place, right? It's all like we can start blaming this or blaming that, or if I hadn't done this or so-and-so hadn't done that, whatever that is, but then that becomes draining, and then it that takes away the power from you. That is one of the reasons I have results. You have to know what the result you want again, in reference to what are the facts, and also in reference to the purpose that you have.

SPEAKER_02 21:55

My God, so so good. The story we tell ourselves, you know. For I it took me a long time, but you know, I I hear people say everything happens for a reason, and I don't like that. Like, I don't agree with that. And I'm not saying it's wrong, it's not my way of thinking. Because I believe, rather, I know that I am a meaning-making machine, which means I assign meaning to the things that happen. I choose, I write the story, and so if I don't like the story, guess what? I could change it. And here's the proof for people because I've had people like Jesse, you're full of it. I'm like, man, I could change my beliefs. We do it all the time. Like, no, we don't. See how we do? Because I used to believe in Santa Claus. I used to believe that I was gonna be uh uh an entertainer, right? Singing, dancing, salsa, bachata, professional dancer, and I believed it, and uh right, like I haven't and and then I changed and assigned meaning to the next thing. So, my point in that is similar to like this idea, this the story that we tell ourselves, when something negative happens, I can assign meaning to it. I can say that is evidence that I am incapable, deficient, and less than, or I can say, ah, there's an opportunity to build a new skill or find somebody in my network that can fill that gap. Right. And it's just all in response to a thing, and I can assign meaning to it or tell myself a different story about that. Am I delusional, Hannah?

SPEAKER_00 23:31

No, no, no, no. And that goes back to the empowerment part, right? Because you won't take the step you you won't take. And that's that's and I know I've been there where I wouldn't take the energy to change the story because I myself have been disempowered or allowed the situation to disempower me. So that's why it goes, you know, going back again to that, to that flow, to that, and what I call in my book, I call it the beat method, you know, because is I have to bring back a lot uh alignment with my purpose, with what I with what I do, with my action. And absolutely right. As the man think is he follows, right? I mean, it's wherever the mind goes, the man follows. So absolutely, we can change with belief. That was one of the lessons I learned actually as a kid, because my I guess my prognosis wasn't right. Um, I was too much of a liability even to go to school. So the thought that if I can't go to school, how am I gonna learn? You know, as a kid, I mean, I I could put that together, you know, it didn't have to be some genius. Like, if you go to school to get education and I can't go to school, how am I gonna be educated? And I've heard what happens to people that don't get educated. My mom was a master's degree in finance and she was a chemical engineer. So I admire my mom, and yet here I am in a bed in a hospital bed, not being able to go to school. So I very much had to learn and change even the belief that I can be educated even from this bed. And I believe that's what got me through when I had the opportunity to be out of bed, when I had the opportunity to go to school to really take advantage of that. But it started first here.

SPEAKER_02 25:09

Yeah, because I I've heard this other I'm gonna ruin this, I'm gonna make it really messy. But like the those experience, I mean, we're gonna come back to this for sure, for sure. Like this experience with your heart and being in the hospital seems to have informed your entire path of to where you are today. Now, that type of experience, it's a transformational, major, major life event. And the so the you know, the interesting analogy or or kind of thought I've heard about this is you know, the difference between superheroes and villains is superheroes go through a traumatic, life-changing event, less than awesome event, and they decide I am going to make sure nobody suffers from that the way I did. Villains say, I'm gonna make sure everybody pays for the pain that I experienced from a similar experience. And so I'm super happy that you decided to be a superhero, Ms. Hannah.

SPEAKER_00 26:13

Now I didn't think of it at the time. I can't say, like, during the circumstance, I was like, yay, I can't breathe. That came like later, and I can tell you that that in itself was transformational because going through any trauma, and this is anybody, right? I mean, anybody going through in an event that like what did I as a kid do to get this dizzy? You know what I mean? Like it could be anything. Uh, it's very hard to in that moment to think like, oh, this is gonna be able to help me. Like, no, I'm just trying to survive. So I would say uh a lot of my experience and even making sense of it really came as an adult, and it really came from having great people in front of me where I saw the example and I looked at I actually had a choice to be not a victim but a victor in that area. But I didn't come up with that. That was the that came a lot later. And uh, and it was again, we don't learn by experience, we learn by reviewed experience. So some things kept me alive from the survival part, which I adopted at that time just to survive. But really, when we're talking about to thrive from a traumatic situation, it really does take work in community.

SPEAKER_02 27:23

Community, oh my goodness. Okay, so so powerful. You were in the thing. Well, just say because everybody has a thing, right? And and it's all relative, which nobody's saying, Oh my goodness, this is hard, and I'm gonna grow tremendously from the situation, right? That's not the reality. We're like, this job's five me. But then you get to a point where it's like, oh, wait a minute, I can transform whatever that is into something of value for and contribute back to the world. You mentioned it's in hindsight, it's in reflection that we can see and and reshape it. You also mentioned that it was community that contributed to you transforming that. What are some of the other things that helped you reframe it and use it as fuel?

SPEAKER_00 28:13

I think when the pain to stay in the same place was way more than the pain to get out of it, and I realized it was painful both ways, but it was it was like just so painful. It's like, hey, I I know I want to change, I did want to change, I knew that I have been given a second chance at life, more than second, third, fourth. And I owed it to myself to go through the pain to get out and and do something. And nothing's guaranteed, right? In life, you really don't have any guarantees, but you gotta try. Especially give yourself that chance. Um, and I think that's really a lot of times what happens after you've been through something traumatic, either by health or in a relationship, at work, even getting laid off, um, losing what might even seem your profession. That part is really coming to that, hey, when it hurts so much, it hurts so much to stay. That's really the pain to get out there and try something new and try again. So that was that. It was coming to the realization it's gonna hurt either way, which way you want it.

SPEAKER_02 29:18

Take your pain, it's gonna hurt either way. Oh, I mean, real, real, real talk. Okay, so the heart apparently you had a heart condition that you've been dealing with dealing with since all the way back in the day. We talked about leadership, tachycardio. We've been talking about breathing, the beat, the pulse, the the seasons of business, this beat and pulse of your life. So there's a lot of connection here to the heart. Yes. And I've heard this thing called heartnomics. What it's what's that? Is there a connection?

Heartnomics Innovation Born From Risk

SPEAKER_00 29:54

Absolutely, it's a connection. So for me, that came as a reality. And again, the for example, my heart disease, it wasn't something I could cure myself. I mean, it was I depended on there was doctors, there's a lot of failure points. There was a lot of people that were involved in my story. It wasn't like I overcame it, I didn't. There was nothing I could do as a kid. Um, but yet what came up from that was an innovative surgery. So hardnomics really speaks to that. Heartnomics is about that economy of the heart. When you do have the what it seems as almost impossible, situations, but yet you have the passion to go through. But then you have a lot of failure points, but yet there's processes and systems you're learning together in leadership becomes the economy of the heart because that's what gives rise to innovation. Um, again, for for me, what I'm I'm here, obviously, I'm okay, I don't have heart disease anymore. Um, but that wasn't a reality until that innovation came. And yes, I actually found out later. I didn't even know this until like 20 years later, when they did a documentary on my surgery. Yeah, for the hospital, and they were doing a hundred-year anniversary, and I didn't realize the impact that my surgery had. And I was at the medical breakthrough for heart disease in 1992. So, what did that mean? It was I was the first kid to undergo this very high-risk surgery. And 20 years later, I come to find out that it had actually saved 3,000 other children through the same hospital.

SPEAKER_02 31:28

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_00 31:30

So that was like the point where it finally came. So I think it was like 20 years in between, where it's like this blank, you don't even know. Like, I went through this, I didn't even talk about it. You know, like I there was nothing, nothing that I that really like, I'm okay. You know, like I don't really want to say what happened. I want to move on with my life, uh, go go do it. But then when I heard that, that's when uh I understood the impossibility of this even coming to be in the failure and even the fear from my doctors and the medical community of what's going on. And that's when harnomics came to life because I understood it took leadership to have both great people that that love that keeps you going, but also the systems, the processes in place so that we learn from our failures, so that we learn from our mistakes and continue moving forward to innovate.

SPEAKER_02 32:28

Oh my goodness. I I one thing that bounced in my head when you said that is the risk, right? The first time the thing that they did this complex surgery, thank goodness, because thousands of people since then and going into the future, it's now it's like, yeah, we know how to do that. This is the thing, it's not a big deal. But being the first is tremendous risk. Now, you were the experiment, yeah, but the people that were doing it, they were taking on massive risk. Yes, and the leadership, grit, courage, all of those things around taking a risk with somebody's life, a young person's life is massive, and what what now in you know general leader like leadership outside of we'll say the operating room is there's the same. A lot of the decisions and actions that leaders are taking out there is a matter of risk. It is, and I don't think that very many people that haven't lived that understand that. What do you think?

SPEAKER_00 33:43

Oh, I I I think that we kind of put it under the rug, like I said, leadership, because there is risk. But when do you need leadership? You need leadership when things are not so clear, otherwise, we're all just just follow the roadmap. You don't need leadership for a roadmap, you just follow it. But it is in those times of conflict, it is in those times of we don't know what to do, that's when the leader rises. So it is key when everything is gonna have a risk in that. There's a risk to do it, there's a risk not to do it. Yes, there's there's pain again in either way. Um, and as a leader, I do agree with you in that a lot of times we forget that we look at the perks of leadership and we don't look at the cost of leadership. Yes. Where you know we're not seeing like, hey, it does take first. And then no, there's no roadmap. I mean, I've had that even with my business, you know, when we were going through ebooks, when we only were print books, didn't know how to do a business plan with that technology. Kind of similarly what's going on now, right? I mean, we're like we have AI, we have those that adopt it, those that are not adopting it. What does that look like? There's no roadmap on what does a business doing fully AI that's been around for a while, not like the last two weeks, runs, right? Like there's no longevity, so it's gonna take risk, it's gonna take testing, it's gonna take failure, it's gonna take all of these things, and that happens. I mean, that's leadership.

SPEAKER_02 35:10

Yes, oh my god, I love that you point out like if there's a roadmap, you don't need a leader, just follow the stupid map.

SPEAKER_00 35:18

Yeah, I don't need to tell me what my GPS is doing. Like, no, I'll just do what the thing says. Like, I don't have to bring call a friend, you know. I got it. When do I call a friend when I don't know where I'm going?

SPEAKER_02 35:31

Oh my god, that's so good. Okay, so we've talked about improvement, and again, I I confess I was talking to you. You Six Sigma, Baldridge, like what got you into maybe I'll ask this a different way. When you were in the hospital, were you like, you know what? I want to learn about statistics, continuous improvement, system design, measuring. Is that what happened?

SPEAKER_00 35:59

Not at all.

SPEAKER_02 36:00

I was just trying to breathe.

Systems Thinking For Healthy Organizations

SPEAKER_00 36:04

That was like the only thing. Uh I that was a dream. I my dream was to go to school one day. The good thing, and I mean, I guess it comes back to a belief, right? The belief was that eventually I did get out of the hospital bed, I did take AP classes, I did graduate from high school, I did go to college on a full-paid scholarship, and I did become CEO of uh not just any publishing, educational publishing K through 12. So even in the places where I wasn't able to be at, I was now leading that, and then later on I was able to be a leader in the sector in Washington, DC, being at the table with other content development. So I say that because getting to the table with other amazing leaders. I mean, my who was who was around the table? Well, your Microsoft's, your Hewlett-Packard's, your Pearson, your penguin books, all of these people. So, what got me there? And what I believe is not because I was so smart, because I really don't think I'm smart, but I did recognize the it leveraged the intelligence, the knowledge of other people. And that came through that desperation, really just trying to breathe. So, what got me into Six Sigma, what got me into Baldrich was that desperation to really find solutions that were gonna work for my own leadership, for my own business, for my people that started like, okay, I need to, I know I need this, I don't know exactly how to do it, so let me get educated. And that's one of the things about um leadership is that you're always raising that bar, right? I mean, you want to attract greater leaders, you gotta raise the bar for yourself. So for me, that that's what it was. It was I learned that I couldn't do things for myself, I didn't get out of my heart disease by myself. There was no way I wasn't gonna get out of my problem with income and not knowing the ebooks and not knowing all of this stuff by myself. I knew that much. I wasn't as much, but I knew that much. So I knew I wasn't gonna be able to get out of it and I needed something else. And that's where a system I learned about systems because of my heart and circular the cardiovascular system. I also knew what happened when my cardiovascular system was not well. My muscles didn't work well, my respiratory system didn't work well. I didn't have a problem with my lungs, I had a problem with my heart, but guess what? My lungs weren't working well because my heart wasn't working well, and guess what? My muscles weren't working because they were not getting oxygen. So I realized as a systems thinking that the same way in organizations is that so it maybe you have a sales system problem. Well, I'm sure the sales system is not gonna only impact the sales system in your company, it's probably impacting your product development, it's impacting your financial department, it's impacting even the way you hire the talent that you hire. So that systematic view, I knew I needed to learn the systems of a healthy organization because an organization is a living organism, just like humans are.

SPEAKER_02 39:03

Hannah, you are speaking my love language. That's good. It's it's connected, right? And we it's so easy. I I think it's just human nature, without you know the learning and obsessive thinking that I do. It's human nature to attack the person that's closest to the break in the system and blame the other person and replace the person. Yeah, but you put another person in that spot. Guess what? When that fault triggers again, you're gonna fire the person again. It's like, no, no, no, no. Let's evaluate the system. That person is a victim of a poorly designed system, and we're not understanding the connectivity between, like you said, this function is impacting everything else. We got to understand the relationships, the interdependencies between the functions of a business because they're absolutely connected. So I'm with you on that 100%. And I love again, it's it's I would say a miracle or miraculous in that your experience with the heart disease and overcoming that and how that has shaped and informed everything that you're doing today, because it's like crystal clear to you. I've never heard like the connection of a system to the cardiovascular musculature, our our respiratory system, like it is all connected, and it's the same in business. And so that analogy, I think, is I'm gonna you I'm gonna steal it, Hannah. But I think it'll help other people, like it's all connected.

Getting Used To Being Well

SPEAKER_00 41:42

It does. I mean, because you think about in a business, I mean, what's the oxygen? Well, it's money. If you don't have money, there's no breathing. So, I mean, it's not the most important thing, but it's right there. You need the money to move things in the business. So that's the part, not the heart, right? I mean, it's the oxygen, but the heart. Well, that's your people, that's the ones that you're seeing, that you exist, all the parts. So you're understanding that there's different roles, they're just as important. I mean, if you're not breathing, you can have a very healthy heart, you know, loving, passionate, all the stuff, you're still not gonna make it. You still gotta be part, but you're not it's blocked, you know. You you're you you gotta look at it. So um, I think the systems part, I knew it from my heart. I I understood. So I like I said, I didn't know everything, but I did understand that part. So when I had the opportunity to learn more about, wait a second, somebody's looking at this already. Uh, that's when I started using again, not my own knowledge, I started learning. What is somebody else? You know, what was available? Um, and with Six Sigma, it actually helped me with the process because once we identify the system, the process itself, like, okay, if it's a muscular problem, like, hey, I just need to reinforce my muscles, well, then I know too, I need to work out. I don't need to be having heart surgery. Like, you know, I need to exercise, you know, my heart's fine. So understand that Six Sigma allowed to do that. Okay, how do we do that more efficiently? How do we work the muscles? How do we, you know, what what is the the right uh environment for it to grow? So just having understanding of that with the body is really what helped me, even in in leadership. Again, it wasn't something that I was like, oh, I just woke up one morning and that happened. It's just really out of desperation. I think every time it's been more of that the pain of like, I can't stay here, then uh more even like knowing where to go because I really didn't know where to go. Even when I got well, when I didn't have the heart disease anymore, I was so used to not knowing what to expect, not being well, that when I was well, I felt horrible. Like, what's going on? Yeah, like what you know, like no, there has to be something wrong. I mean, I almost even like in being well, I was almost looking to feeling sick. And that was about a couple of years because that was familiar, that was familiar to me. It was familiar to have monitors and things and people telling me what I'm well or not well. I mean, it I was used to that. So I would say that too for those of you that have gone through traumatic events or that have gone through a big change, understanding that just like it takes time to change, it takes time to really be well with being well, with being out of that part, and understanding what that feels like.

SPEAKER_02 44:21

Oh Hannah, so so powerful because it's easy to overlook that. We become conditioned, like when when there's a transformation, leadership transformation, personal awakening, the conditions around us change, right? Similar to heart disease gone, you don't have things beeping and blinking and people poking and checking, and and then all of a sudden it's like, whoa, like what do I do with my hands? I don't know, like it's different. Same. So when I started, and I'm gonna put it in dumb terms, because y'all, I'm a dummy, and to help other like make it super, super clear for people. When I started taking care of myself. What part of that looked like was I stopped creating crises for myself because I loved the chaos, right? And so when I started doing that, taking care of myself, I wasn't creating, you know, the the chaos or adding to the chaos. And all of a sudden I'm like, what's what's going on? Like, where's where's the impending doom? For a while, what I would do was I would go and create a little bit of chaos because I didn't feel right, but eventually I got accustomed to like, oh, like things don't always have to be red line, burning, screaming, yelling. Like it can be this easy, it can be as easy as I allow it to be. I just need to let it be.

SPEAKER_00 45:51

And it took me a long time to do that. And that's growth. And it really, I mean, it really does because sometimes we we think when we're in that situation, like, oh, I just can't wait till it's over, can't wait, it's over. And sometimes it may have been over for a while. You just didn't realize it's like, wait, wait a second. Um, you know, why am I responding? And that goes again into leadership. That's why I say into like the leadership tachycardia, because we keep it up like this, and it's like, no, you need to take that time to the slow down. We we have to because we can create, like you said, just like that. And sometimes we don't know how to operate differently because that right, that's where even things like procrastination come in, where we create an emergency where there was no emergency, right? Where things like just leaving it to the last minute or creating something, and that happens again. I had to break out from that, and it was something like wanted to keep come back again, and again, because that's how I lived. I mean, so it takes work, and that's what's important. Leadership development. That's why coaching comes in. That's I mean, I started myself with coaches. I had a coach for different times at different seasons for performance that I wanted to do, uh, mentors that would show me the way that, like, oh, well, they do that, and that's amazing. I mean, like, I why can't I be like that? So you can be, you're just making a big to-do out of well, you don't have to. So having the mentors in your life that can show you a different way in the community, and that's where accountability comes in in a community because it's uh really being accountable to the to the situation, and it's not in a punitive way, but you really can't be like accounting to myself. If I could just do it by myself, I would have done it a long time ago. Like, you know, because I don't want to be there. So accountability is really having that other people, that that that community, that support group. And again, a system is not a system by itself, a system is always surrounded by other systems.

SPEAKER_02 47:40

Yeah. So, folks out there, if you haven't caught the theme here, there's a heart theme. Let me just let me say it at the beginning, the heart right there at the beginning. We talked about Ms. Hannah helping folks lead with hope, which starts with an H, empowerment, which starts with an E, accountability, starts with an A, results starts with an R, and trust. And then we've talked about the beat and your heart disease, heartnomics. So if you missed it, anybody that's dense like me, this is what we're talking about, and this is Hannah's expertise. And and I want to add, like, it's not just your expertise, it's not just you know, acronyms and really great marketing. What I'm getting, Miss Hannah, is like this is for real, for real, real life. What the hell you care about? And it's the maybe the fuel cell to the value and the way that you contribute to the world. Am I wrong?

SPEAKER_00 48:45

Oh, you're not wrong at all. That's exactly like uh there's there's a price that has come along with this. And I mean, I just some of the things that I think all of us go through, right? It's like I don't understand why I went through that. And later on in life, it starts making sense. And it, like I said, it doesn't make sense right away. It took years, actually, it took me watching it on TV to realize, oh, that's what that was. Um, and even then, it's still unpacking it some more. So I yeah, definitely it's a passion, but I believe that's in everybody. I believe everybody has a story, I believe everybody has a message, and it though it may not have come in like an acronym or you know, you're doing conversations, it's there. Um, and it's worth it to look inside. It's worth it because it that that message really has the potential to be able to impact other lives. Like I said, my the surgery, the innovative surgery. Yes, I was the beneficiary of that, but my goodness, 3,000 other kids that I don't know. I never know. I probably will never know them, you know. But they were impacted by this, you know, by the person that went first. And sometimes that's what happens. Some of you are already out there, you have this message, and they'll take you being first. Maybe nobody talks about it. That's okay. You talk about it. Maybe nobody leads with that courage yet. You lead with courage. But and we talked about barely with with like we haven't talked about trust, but even in a world where we're trust efficient and it's difficult to trust, you give trust, you be that trustworthy person, you be that again, like Andy says, right now, you be the change that you want to see in the world. Um, and it does take leadership and it does take boldness and it does take knowing your message to be able to make a difference with that message. And I believe that's in everybody.

SPEAKER_02 50:23

I agree. And I want to add, because this is the struggle I had for over a decade when I finally like, oh, I got to do something with this. The first person or the person I struggled to trust the most was myself. Like it took a lot of work. I had to learn how to forgive myself, and then I was able to learn to trust myself. But I didn't even know that I had very low expectations of my own self. And so, the reason I share that is folks, if you're out there, like it's not easy. We're talking about years, decades to come to terms to get clarity, to transform the muddy, sicky stuff that we're dealt in life and transforming it into something meaningful and impactful for other people. It doesn't happen overnight, it doesn't happen at a retreat, doesn't happen in yoga and coffee. It took years. Oh my goodness. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 51:24

But it's fun, it's part of what makes life. It's fun, it's what first make makes life life. I mean, honestly, I mean, we didn't learn to do the things we did in a year. We're still learning. I think that's the curiosity that right that we have, and then understanding and the excitement, and really not even losing that childlike, hey, you know, I can still figure out what I want to do when I grow up.

Excellence Beats Perfection Every Time

SPEAKER_02 51:42

So yes, I want to go back to a point that you made earlier, or something that stuck in my head before I ask you like the grand slam question. You mentioned it felt like you drew a comparison or a contrast between excellence and perfection.

SPEAKER_01 52:01

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 52:02

Can you say more about that? Because I I don't I want to make sure we don't miss that.

SPEAKER_00 52:06

Yeah, well, you can just even see like what even in how you act. Like perfection, for example, perfection will prevent you from doing something because you want everything to be right and be perfect, and then no, I gotta learn more or hear another thing or talk some more. So perfection, you understand if you're in that cycle, is because you're really not moving forward towards excellence. We'll say, Okay, I got this information and know a little bit, I'm gonna do a little bit. I'm gonna fail a little bit too. You know, so being okay with failure, excellence does that. Excellence looks at failure, but actually, let me excellence says, I'm gonna take this, take this out right now. And as I take it out, I'm gonna learn. Doesn't mean that, oh, you know, you take take it or leave it, this is the way it is. No, it's that commitment to I'm gonna get information so then I can adjust. Perfectionists not looking for the adjustment, perfection is very rigid. Perfection is looking at like, hey, has to take that 100%, and even what that 100% may look like, you know, it is you don't even know. So you're always and not there's a problem with learning, but you're always that. But under learning or you need one more thing is never enough to where excellence says I take forward, I like you know, I'll go forward and I will learn what enough is, I will learn what I need instead of like I need to have everything I need before I move forward. So there's those those different parts, and really how you can see it if you're in that cycle is what actions are you taking? What things that you know that you need to do right now are you not doing because you might be stuck in that perfectionist cycle versus excellence. Excellence doesn't mean perfect, it does not at all. On the contrary, I mean think about what is perfect, you know, like it doesn't have that. Uh so excellence again, you can be excellent and still have failure points, but that commitment to learn from them is what really is gonna take you that sustainability. Perfection is not sustainable, perfection is gonna disappoint, excellence is gonna innovate.

SPEAKER_02 54:11

Yes, oh my god, gangster micro. I'm with you, right? Like the perfection thing is like doesn't leave room for improvement mostly because you never make any progress, you never make a decision, you never put it out into the world. So I'm caught up in my perfection, and that's just between my ears.

SPEAKER_00 54:35

That's right. Usually just one try to get 12 people to agree on everything, I'm not gonna happen. Like every single day now.

SPEAKER_02 54:43

Yes, yes. Awesome. Forward moment, and I love that. So, folks out there, if you didn't catch that, there's I agree, highest quality, right? Excellence, all of that, yes, a hundred percent. But if you're not moving, you're stuck in perfection. Excellence looks like movement. Would that be a fair way to think about it?

SPEAKER_00 55:07

Absolutely. That they need to start movement. That's that's a spirit of excellence. I mean, that's why we clap when we see the marathon runners, even like at the end that they finished a race. It may look old messy and all this stuff, but like, oh my gosh, we love them just as much, sometimes even more than who got first place. We'll remember that one person, right? Like, no matter what. Oh my gosh, because we see that spirit of excellence, like, hey, I finished, I finished racing. Look like oh bad, but you know, it's that continue, that that commitment to excellence.

SPEAKER_02 55:35

That is you just gave me chills because I've run a few marathons and I never won any of them.

SPEAKER_00 55:42

It doesn't look pretty now. I haven't run one yet.

How To Work With Hannah

SPEAKER_02 55:45

Oh my goodness. Okay, so Hannah, I'm inspired by you. It's clear to me that you've got a wealth of experience of value that you can help individual leaders, teams within organizations, etc. And so if somebody wanted to work connect with you, where do we send them?

SPEAKER_00 56:05

Well, first place to heartnomics.com. That's a way that you can learn how to connect. You know, if you want to do a 20-minute strategy session, I also have a complimentary assessment there for alignment for the heart, leading with heart, and also for your organizations. I also LinkedIn. Yeah, connect. I'm I'm very active in there, so I still respond to all my messages. So if you want to connect that way, it'll be awesome as well.

SPEAKER_02 56:29

Okay, so heartnomics.com, complimentary assessment. If you didn't complimentary means you don't have to pay, fill it out. We'll get some help for the individual for the organization. I love that. And then on LinkedIn, everybody knows I'm a LinkedIn psychopath, so connect with Hannah, connect with me, we'll and we'll just keep making the world better. Now, I'm super excited about asking you the closing question, Hannah, because there's just so much real, like massive reality in what you brought to this conversation. The your level of or your depth of vulnerability is astounding, considering this is the first time you and I have ever talked. Um super, super impressive. And you know, the lessons that you pulled from life, right? Like discovering that, oh my goodness, I'm gonna need help, and there's experts out there that I should rely on as a result of dealing with the heart disease. Like, I still haven't come to terms with that, Hannah. That I need experts, that I don't have to do it, like it's not possible to do it myself. And so the way you learn the way you draw lessons just from life experience, all of those things are getting me excited about what your answer is going to be to the question. So, you ready for the question? I'm ready. Okay, here it is. What is the promise you are intended to be?

SPEAKER_00 57:59

Oh, what is a promise that I'm intended to be? Well, I think one of the promises is to bring that alignment, understanding that internal alignment really does have to do with external execution. Because that promise I deal both for me as a leader, and and that is a lot of what I do is first is that person in front of me. That's the number one is the agenda, is them is bringing that because understanding that you cannot give what you don't have, but also because we want to do something, we want to be purposeful. We're here to also be fulfilled and enjoy life. So understanding that the internal alignment is gonna help me be that much more productive and be able to operate in my purpose so that I can bring fulfillment, not only with what I do for others, but also have that fulfillment back for me.

SPEAKER_02 58:49

My goodness, folks. Y'all need to go back and replay that and listen to that about five more times. You dropped some gems in here. Internal alignment is external execution. We talked about the leadership tachycardia. Just there's so much value that that Hannah, I'm I'm grateful to you for being so generous with your time and your insight for for our listeners out there. Thank you. Did you have fun?

SPEAKER_00 59:17

I did, I enjoyed it. Thank you so much. You made it you made it so light. I love talking to you. So I don't think you're a psychopath for the record.

SPEAKER_02 59:25

Thank you. You know what? I'm gonna clip that, Hannah, and I'm gonna post it because now I have evidence that at least one person doesn't think I'm a psychopath.

SPEAKER_00 59:35

Well, I've only met you once. Give a disclaimer.

Subscribe Share And Download The Book

SPEAKER_02 59:40

Oh, that was so good. Before you go, I want to thank you for spending part of your day with me. Your time and attention mean a ton. And it's because of listeners like you that this podcast even exists. If you enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to subscribe to the Learnings and Missteps podcast so you never miss an episode and you get extra credit if you share it with your friends. Also, if you want even more insights on leadership, personal growth, communication, you know, all those fancy magical things, you can sign up for my newsletter on LinkedIn because I got a newsletter that goes out every single Monday. All the resources I share there are designed to help you put yourself first so that you can leave this world better than you found it. There's also a digital copy of my book, Becoming the Promise You're Intended to Be. And it's sitting there waiting for you on my website. All you gotta do is do the click and do the download and you get the free PDF. And if you want even more bonus points, share that PDF with somebody you know or the family of somebody you know that is currently struggling with self-destructive behavior. That would be the ultimate gift for me. While you're there, do some exploring of the trainings, workshops, and services that are designed to enhance your performance at home and at work. Just click the link in the show notes to check it out. Thanks again for listening. Take care of yourself, and I'll see you on the next episode. Peace.