Dec. 30, 2021

Transforming the Trade Industry Through Collaboration, Humanity, and Resilience with Henry Nutt

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When we cross the finish line together, we can celebrate together. Teams that don’t recognize that are painfully missing out on the beauty of collaboration and humanity. At the end of the day, you can choose to make your work painful or you can choose to make it collaborative, creative, and rewarding. So, which will you choose?

In this episode, I speak with Henry Nutt, a well-known speaker and industry influencer who’s passionate about transforming the construction industry through collaboration. While traveling the country walking jobsites, speaking to industry leaders, and participating in various seminars, he has found that one of the most common issues between Owners, General Contractors, and Trade Partners is our inability to identify core issues. This inability stifles a project team's opportunity to truly collaborate and quickly create solutions.

Henry’s objective is to educate owners and construction leaders on how to effectively utilize Lean Tools, work as a team, and execute work efficiently with a minimal amount of waste.

Listen in to learn Henry’s powerful insights on how we can work together to effectively and efficiently transform the construction industry and make it an industry we all can thrive in.

What You’ll Learn in this Episode:

·       The power of building community and seeking connection with others in the construction industry.

·       Henry’s journey in construction & The major difference between managing projects and managing people.

·       Why Henry speaks about Lean Tools & How Lean Tools improves leadership and teamwork.

·       How Henry developed resilience, endurance, and grit while building a credible reputation as a professional in the construction industry.

·       The importance of vulnerability and taking time for healing.

·       Bringing your whole self to work: Why we need to prioritize humanity in construction & How that impacts safety and decision-making.

·       Henry explains the concept of One Project, One Team and the book he’s currently writing.

·       Major learnings and missteps Henry has had throughout his career.

·       Henry answers: What footprint do you intend to leave on the world?

Resources Mentioned:

Learn more about Lean Tools: 




Connect with Henry Nutt:

Connect with him on LinkedIn:


To stay connected with us and listen to more episodes,


And so that was like the best, like the bedrock for me, of, of what are the other things that I get to do, because they still require some of that, those same disciplines of hard work of standing strong in the midst of the storm of not giving up of showing up every day. No matter if you feel like it or not, it's all those things that really nothing else would have matter. Obviously, inspirations and aspirations and goals that I had and still have, if I don't have that bedrock. How to be tenacious and not discouraged and sometimes motivate yourself when no one else is there to encourage you, or when, when you do open it up and say, Hey, I need help. It's all those things that, that really fundamentally keep me moving forward. Oh, man, that is Mr. Henry nut. And I got to tell you, I talked to him for almost two hours and it was a pretty darn amazing experience. I walked away feeling enthused, warmed, and motivated about what's coming up in the future. I bet that you're going to get the same type of feeling after listening to our episode. So we talk about some pretty like deep, deep things, and believe it or not. These thoughts and ideas were coming from a plumber and a sheet metal guy. No, we touch on the importance of vulnerability and self care, like taking care of yourself and giving yourself space for healing. And then the big thing, there's this swell coming up in our, in the construction industry anyways, about appreciating people and respect for people. I know, I know we say that those words a bunch, but Henry and I really get into why we need to prioritize humanity. In construction and how that impacts safety decision-making profits, the whole thing. And for far too long, we have not been accounting for the human beings and the human side of things. And so being able to talk about this with Henry in preparation for the no BS with Jen and Jess livestreams. It just feels like there's this continuity out there that I bet y'all can feel as well. And I'm looking forward to interacting with you all assume. Oh. And then, you know, the never ending struggle. Henry talks to us about his experience when he went from managing projects to managing people. Which is a pretty darn significant shift for anybody that's become responsible for developing people, uh, and, and leading a business. Um, we'll just say opinions. You'll get the rest of it as he listened to the rest of the show. So we want to give a shout out to our patrons, of course, because they have been faithful. We have a full year behind us. Thank you, patrons for supporting us through 2021. An amazing experience to learn and grow with you, knowing that you're behind us and supporting us with the dollars, because this stuff ain't free cost some money, and we're looking forward to an amazing 2022. There is, there's a bunch of stuff in the oven right now, and L and M family. I hope that we are serving you appropriately and thank you for continuing to listen to us. And here we go. What's going on L and M family. Here we are with Mr. Henry nut. How you doing Henry? I am doing great. How are you doing? You know, we were kind of chatting before we kicked off here. I'm like a little star struck being able to, to spend some time with you. And you're, you're in California right now. Yeah. Northern California, Northern California. I, you know, I've been to the LCI congresses and been able to see you up on stage and BCU watch you in the. Behind the scenes playing major roles there. And so for me to like have this time where was like, man, this is so cool. Cause Henry's got it going on. That's how I'm doing. You know, that's so funny you saying that. And I, and I get a lot of that from people and I don't feel like I'm some celebrity or anything, you know, but I know a lot of people have said that, and, and I've been in this or 15 years as far as I guess, being in the limelight. But it's never been about that instead. We've been about the limelight. It's always been about the people and trying to do work that matters and getting better at it, you know, and really understanding what matters to people and how you really can impact people. So I think. That message resonates with people. And somehow it's, it's, it's given me a platform, but I didn't ask for, you know, I don't know, Hey, hinders Henry, Henry. He needs to beat the celebrity. And I think it was he that guy. Yeah. That's well, and that's the beautiful thing though, is your just giving back, right? You're you're just serving and contributing to the community. And from there, the what's the, the influencer, the celebrity comes with that you know, and we've seen it on the news and stuff where people are like just aimlessly chasing fame, and we kind of, we get to see them crash and burn and not get to see they crash and burn. And it's painful for human beings, but, but you've been super consistent, always there. And I think it's because of where you're coming from your heart, right. You're wanting to serve the community and serve people. And so it's like this, this energy that just keeps feeding into itself and it grows and it grows and grows. And before, you know, it you're a celebrity, but you know, I, I have I've been a firm believer of staying in your lane, you know, in other words, kind of knowing what your gifts and talents. And as other ones have all or kind of erect, you know, recognition, you, you, you can develop those, but no, what you do know what you do well and do that. Right. And, and try to stay there. And that becomes come the mission and the heartbeat of what you do. And it doesn't feel like work, right? It feels like it feels like a part of your daily life. And so it's easy to do you get onstage. You're not rehearsing. A bunch of speeches is just, you're talking to people because it comes from the inside, you know, and I get a chance to look at some stuff I've done years ago. When I first went the pioneer war for LCI and I was looking at some videos, I was being interview. And in this, the speech I get for recognition recognizing my, you know, the people that helped me along the way. And I was listening to it literally last week and thinking, wow, I've talked for about two minutes and it wasn't a speech that I prepared. It was. From the heart. And those were real words that was kind of impressed with myself thinking like, yeah, that was pretty cool, man, that, that stuff you say, and didn't know, 1600 people were in the audience or whatever, it was just really just talking to people about your life and what you've done and taking time to thank the people that, you know, that helps you along the way. So it's been a great journey. Never would've thought it would have brought me in this space and being connected to such smart, amazing people that care like me and yourself. That's really the plus part of this is just the community that should be that's that that part can never be taken away. And it's like a lifelong thing that you'll always have. Yeah, the community thing is, is profound. And, you know, I, I, you know, I cheat a little bit, I've watched some YouTube videos of how do you build a community and how do you build your social media brand and you know, all that kind of stuff. And yeah. And they talk about like real mechanical, transactional type things to do. I was like, man, that's, that's kinda that I'm not cool with that. I don't like that. And, and then, you know, Jennifer and I, and you and Adam, and like Felipe is Jason. Like all these people, James Pease, like I started kind of studying everybody's like when people were just kind of showing up and just being themselves Spencer, buddy, Keyan , Joe, there's a gigantic list of people that just show up and they're their full selves and it creates the community. I don't have to. Three times a day and go back and like, and comment on everybody's message to build a community. I just gotta be me and find people that resonate and that's building a community. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so interesting that, that all those folks that you just named plus others, right. Are we all are somewhat connected already? Like we found ourselves somehow connected because of the message, because of the passionate for what we do. And it's just been easy to, you know, I've seen Jennifer at Congress. And in the midst of COVID, right. It's kind of like, you know, you see the person that you've seen online and spoke with, and then you just hug each other. Right. And just like, cause you feel like family, you feel like you like known each other with this, you know, the mission behind what you're doing and, or the reason for the mission. And so it just that kindred spirit thing that you talked about and all those folks, Joe and Adam, you know, Jason obviously flux, all of us are somewhat connected in different areas and space in this industry. And this we're linked because of our passion and our love to really transform this industry. And it's just easy, you know, it's like, you just see you sit with friends when you, whenever you're around them. And it's like, you're just catching up and talking about what's going on and, and the movement and all that stuff, man. So it's, it's great to have that, that group of people that again, you call your community and. You throw something on light on LinkedIn or whatever, and it just like, all these folks are just talking about it and then, cause it's just, it's what we do. It's like it's our life, you know, it's yes, yes. It's a lifestyle, right. We have a common lifestyle and, and it, it breeds goodness. Ideally breeds goodness into, into the industry and, and transforming, you know, it's a rough industry. We've had some conversations about that and the impact that the job itself can have on the human psyche, on the family on loved ones. Thank goodness it's such a brig group of us, cause there's a lot of work to be done to make it such that it better serves the men and women that are out there doing the work. Because it ruins relationships. It ruins people's health and. That's me, I've lived, I've lived that. So I'm sure you may have experienced some degree of that as well. So for the audience, Henry, what should the L and M family know about you? You know, I'm a regular guy at the end of the day, you know, I'm like, unlike you, you know, I'm a, I'm a regular guy, I'm a dad, I'm a family. I care about this industry so much that I do all this extra stuff on top of my day job. And, and somehow as a general superintendent, I'm not anymore, but when I first first begin that in that role for south Atlanta first I got that 34 years overall in the industry as a sheet metal worker, that's, that's my background and climbing into the role where I was going to impact people. It was kind of a daunting thing because I remember sitting down with my division leader at that time. And he said the difference between what you've been doing and what you're going to do now, or what we expect you to do is you're not managing projects anymore, got to manage people. And, and the difference between the other projects and the people is I've got 500 people with 500 different opinions. And so it's about how do you, how do you get that herding cats kind of thing, you know, make that effective. And so I think it's just one I'm, I'm a regular guy like anyone else? I have a mission and a plan, I believe in the words that I say I stand behind them because I I've seen them. I've experienced the stuff that I talk about. And, but I'm no different than anyone else, you know, and I may have a different message. Well that aligns with others, but comes from a different perspective because my background is different. I think that's the beauty of what we all do is, is that the message is similar. But the perspective of, of, of what we bring is different refreshing it's kind of like this kaleidoscope of thoughts and ideas that kind of match, you know, in his own unique way with the whole story. And it's important each one of those stories from all of us, because each, each his message resonates differently with someone else, you know, and that's the beauty of what we do. It's like this collective going down this path and reaching the world and trying to revolutionize and transform an industry that is. Hard, right. It has, it is dismissed people, shoot them up and spit them out and kept going, you know, and, and I, and I've been, I've been on the victim side of that, you know, for sure and written, realizing the impact of that. So that's probably more of my perspective is really, I stand for the person that, or the people that have been chewed up. I stand with the people that haven't had a voice. I stand with the people that really feel like this industry is not for them. And so when I tie all the lean stuff and the tools and, you know, the practical things that we can do to be better and more efficient, I bring in that kind of, you know, piece to the table with, so my message is always intertwined with that people site and that, that person and folks that haven't really had the voice and feel less than, and not recognized or acknowledged. So I'm, I'm out for the, for that small voice. I'm that one who looks for the one that's the sheet that's kind of went astray and, and ready to jump off the cliff. I'm that person that wants to message to that individual or group of people, because that was me, you know? So that's something I would want this, this group to know about me. Yeah. Oh my God. That's amazing. There's a, there's a whole lot there and I'm going to go digging what I heard, what I heard was do you want to speak for the unseen, the unheard, the discarded, if that feels less than and. And you also mentioned about this, this kaleidoscope, the view in the vision of the hope and the opportunity is this kaleidoscope of people and thoughts and ideas and diverse perspectives, which, you know, people write stuff about it, right. They post little memes and really with real, pretty looking things. is it that easy? Is it as easy as posting a pretty mean Henry? Yeah. You and I both know it's not I wished it were, or maybe I can't even say, I wish it worked because if it was that simple, it'd be solved by, you know, last year more. And no, it's not. And I think people mean well. But we're talking about human beings, talking about people that show up at work every day. Maybe in part in their wholesales or maybe their full selves with a bunch of baggage. And, and I've always, I've always thought about this until people, we never know what people are going through from day to day. We never know what someone brings to the table at work. And when they miss perform and they let us down or they don't meet the expectation, it's really easy to discard and throw away. And that's what we've done in this industry. We don't give second chances or opportunities or try to understand. And that's what I love about lean is that it really does focus on those things. And it talks about reflection and how important that is to, to really think about talks about five why's and really analyzing why this, why did this really happen? And for the, for the folks and the leaders that actually really get that, I mean, to the point where that's a part of their style of work, then they're going to be better leaders and more effective and have a team that is willing to follow them and not just be a leader of entitled, but one that actually has people following. And so, or, and, and influencing people because they desire and open themselves up to be influenced by someone, you know? And so it's not easy. It takes a lot of work. And then it takes people that what you're doing will resonate and people begin to stress your words because they see the action behind your words. And not just someone that is looking for fame and fortune and, and tell you 10 things you should do. And those 10 things may be right. They may be actually the thing you need, but if no one wants to listen to it because of you don't matter, doesn't matter. Right. Oh, for real. Okay. And so, so we agree it's not easy. Would you also agree that it takes tremendous stamina and grit to continue down the path? Oh yeah. I mean, it's, it's up and down. It's always this influx, right? And as many people as you get who want to follow you, you're going to always have people that, that don't. And what have I have a word to go with it or a message to go with it maybe to discourage you? So yeah, this thing is, it's like the it's it's, this is the the marathon of the business. It's not a quick and easy thing. And that's why, you know, being in this industry for 34 years and being on this mission specifically for over 15 is you look back and you're like, wow. You know, and, but this took a lot of time. And, and then you look at the stories that most people don't know about how you got here. They don't know about the times you were ready to kind of like literally, you know, figures we'd jump off the bridge. To have it all this, you know, it's not worth it. And, and then those who, who really did quit, you know, and those, those people who just gave up and you know, those folks who've been in your life. So, so it's not easy. It's this is like, this is not the the mission for the light of heart. You know, it's, this is folks who, who are willing to stand, but also knowing how to pause and reflect for yourself and give yourself space to, to heal when you have felt broken and discarded, because that's a part of this whole thing. And, and when we stay in it, we learn so many lessons about ourselves and, and how to get stronger and, and know that I think, you know, Jennifer Macy's Ali talked to him about and yourself about vulnerability and, and how that is a powerful characteristic to have, because it opens you up to. Bringing others to help you and not select you have to be this island. And I think that's one of the messages that this industry has, has thrived on being proud of, of it's like one person standing. It's one person, it's one, man. It's one woman, you know, it's all you need. And the survival of the fittest and all that. And that doesn't work except for a very small percentage of people. But most that doesn't work. Yeah. It's not sustainable and it's definitely not healthy. So, so then I haven't been in it, been at it 34 years. I'm wondering Henry, where, where do you, where did you build that muscle? The endurance and the grit to continue forward, to pause and reflect, to get an accept, help. How did you develop those skills? Well, first I have to say, you know, came from a have father that was in this rate and he owned the business in the sheet metal business for about a decade. But one thing he's always showing me before I even got in the trade was just a work ethic and that wasn't through a book or a speech. It was just do a lifestyle and an example, you know? And so he's working two or three jobs. See, before you got into the trade. And he had me doing work around the house, learning how to work on cars and, and to, you know, I was complaining about that, like leave me alone. Right. And three sisters. And so I was the only one that was out there doing that kind of work. And it felt unfair. It probably was, but I had no idea, you know, what. And prepared me for it. So I think I have to start there for sure. Is, is that having someone that really showed me what, what work meant and why was important and how it provided for your family. And so when you got into this rate, you know, I got into the trade at like 19 years old and I'm getting up at four in the morning to drive 40 miles or whatever, and, and be on site somewhere at seven or six 30 in the morning. And that was just what I did. Right. But, but I've never had an issue with it. I knew that I had to go to bed at a certain time to get enough sleep. And it's just all those things that were fundamental that I took for granted that everyone got that. Right. But it was those types of those opportunities and examples that help. But my dad's really into me as an example of what it looks like when to take care of your family, to keep a job, to build a career to build a reputation over in this industry and all that was just handed to me essentially. And so that was like the best, like the bedrock for me, of, of what are the other things that I get to do, because they still require some of that, those same disciplines of hard work of standing strong in the midst of the storm of not giving up of showing up every day. No matter if you feel like it or not, it's all those things that really nothing else would have matter. Obviously, inspirations and aspirations and goals that I had and still have, if I don't have that bedrock. How to be tenacious and not discouraged and sometimes motivate yourself when no one else is there to encourage you, or when, when you do open it up and say, Hey, I need help. It's all those things that, that really fundamentally keep me moving forward. Help has helped me to develop something that has a foundation versus just as being passing an uncertain. This is like real stuff that I know I can lean on. Cause it's, it's been my life for so long. Yeah. The simple things, just show up, get up, get ready, get in that car, get in that truck, make the trip and, and keep doing that 30 years. Yeah. So looking back you know, the world has transformed so dramatically. Like my own personal world is. It seems like to be exploding. And right now you and I are having this conversation. And you mentioned your background is in sheet metal. My background is in plumbing and I know coming up in the trade for a long time, like the sheet metal guys were my nemesis because they were, they were in my way and they felt the same way about me. Right? Like my storm drain needed to have slope, but their medium pressure air distribution was so big that we had, we always had this conflict. And it's like, thinking about that and thinking that you and I are having this conversation now, like at what point in your career did, did you start like flirting with the idea that, you know what, maybe my voice is going to be out there and, and I'm going to be having these types of conversations to be shared with generations. It happened at Southland, you know, so I've been in Southland industries for 15 years and again, being hired as a superintendent there. And because we have a plumbing piping and sheet metal department, we go in as a team typically. Right. And we weren't always a team, even though we had the same hat and shirt on and selling on project sites. Right. But we, but that became my mission. And, and, and I think one of the people that I always acknowledge is Jessica Kelly, you know, who's been around worked for Southland for over 20 years was, was a PM at that time or senior PM. And was one of the people that I worked closely with that was looking for some difference in using lean and actually really executing it in a fashion that supported what we say we stand for. And as far as teamwork and, and all those things. So It was really more about stepping into that role and then recognizing how important my words were with saying, Hey, I'm a sheet metal worker. I Stanford sheet metal. However, I understand how important it is for our company to be successful, requires me to bend. And so when I began to do that and realize how powerful that was and impactful, it was to the project as well as to the people involved. And it was kind of like, oh, that's kind of a new dynamic message. Really. It shouldn't have been, but it was it that's when I began to kind of see that that's what people really were trying to get us to, to collaborate. And before we're even using the word collaboration back then it was recognizing that telling my four men in the field how we need to. Bend and what we need to do to make sure that we, we are successful as a company on this project, not just as a Sheba department. And so my mission did not become about, Hey, because I'm the sheet metal superintendent. It wasn't going to be sheet metal or die. It was going to be soft land or die. And so I needed to make sure, and then it became about the project or die. So it wasn't even just about Southland, right? So it really evolved. And you begin to see how powerful that was for owners and for the general contractors and seeing like, this is something different with this company and our people. So I had to begin to message that with our team and that message beginning to resonate and it kind of does open doors. So it's really back then with just worked on small projects and larger projects, and then really getting engaged with a team. So. You know what, here's, how we can do this in a more effective way. We don't lose because we allow someone to go first, let's understand this and getting people to really begin to pull back those layers of what does collaboration look like? And it's not about just who gets in first, but that even though that's what we've been trained for pat, right? Oh yeah. I finished first up, man. I used to, I used to, I knew it like, okay, we're running behind on the plumbing. Okay. I know how to get us some time released the duct shift, the duck load the floor up with duck. Cause it slowed everybody else down. Farmers got to catch up. I mean, that was not the right thing to do that didn't, that didn't help anybody. I mean, it, it was like, it felt helpful. In the short-term, but in the longterm, it damaged relationships, it damaged material. We moved at 10 times, like it just had all of this compounding negative effect that I didn't understand. And, and, you know, we see it over and over different contractors, GCs function differently. But there's a definite difference in the, the teams that understand that we all cross the finish line together. And if we crossed when we know that and own that, it's an amazing, it's a fun experience. We can do the damn job and like be friends afterwards, right. And the other jobs that the teams that don't recognize it. And they're trying to get across the finish line. First, all you're doing is cussing and screaming and fighting and hating all the way along and it doesn't eat it doesn't, it really doesn't even have to be that painful. But, and we, and we have a choice, right. We can choose to make it awesome. Right. Or we can choose to live in. Right. Yeah. You know, and that is an in, yeah. So many have lived in stinky for their whole career paths and they're angry and, and, and mean-spirited, and short-tempered bullies, you know, and, but that's been the acceptable role, especially of the leadership. And like, if you don't have those qualities and you, you don't make it, you know? And so it's, it's I've always said to people, and this, this trigger with me years ago is again about thinking about life and the time that was spent with the people that, that we work with and then our family. We definitely spend more time with the folks at work, you know, doesn't it the who of us to actually kind of get along or like them a little bit, you know, because maybe more family than the people we sleep next to. So it's really, really important that we look at that and have that perspective when we are engaged in something we do every day for 30 years, you know, and including commuting to wherever that is, it's like all that time that we were there and that space, it should not be this secondary kind of thing on the side. It really is the primary thing on our lives is our work and all the time we spend. So can we do it in a better way? Don't we want to do it a better way. Absolutely. Yeah. What do you think about this? So Jennifer and I are going to be kicking off that no BS with Jen and Jess livestreams and the new year. And, and, and one of the ideas there is that surface through these conversations is Beyond the gate. And what that means is, you know, on the job site or at work, there's this type of thinking that says, you know, leave your problems at home when you're here, be completely focused and, and kind of, and ignores what you, just, everything you just described. Right? We spend more time with people at work than we do with the people we go to sleep next to. And, and what are we doing to honor that human being beyond the gate? Like if we're thinking about a safety perspective, I don't need you just to be safe on the job site. I need you to be you and your family to be safe and protected after hours because I need you back. Like, what are you, what are your thoughts on that? Is that too crazy? Absolutely not. It's total alignment and it totally aligns with what we're trying to accomplish. How do we. How do we really do this? Pull this off. When we talk about building up as an industry and transforming it without really looking at one individual and transforming that individual, and that looks like not just what they do at work, it looks like what they do in life. And so there's been this whole message of your, your, your home life and your professional life are, should be two different things. And really when we talk about bringing your whole self to work well, that doesn't look like me showing up one day at work, but then being a different person at home and my, my problems, my issues, whatever. I had an argument at home or something happened with my child. I don't turn that off at work, even if I'm supposed to, I may try to flip the switch, but if you really know me, you know, this is all inside of me. I'm being distracted as I'm working. And then so people come every day with those types of things and we promote, leave it at home. And they don't, and that's why people get injured is why there's not this, you know, we have these, this high suicide rate in our industry for sure, amongst men. It's, it's along with the, the, the other physical aspects of just the dangerous in our industry that people getting hurt, distractions, poor decision-making and all that ties into just the whole person. So it totally aligns with transforming the industry in a more effective way. And I think even in a more efficient way is allowing people to, to be who they are and, and recognizing, creating space for that. You know, we talk about psychological safety now as a thing, it's really something I'm hearing more and more. And, and that's an important aspect of, of being able to show up and articulate your ideas and thoughts, which are team without feeling like you're going to get slammed for. That may sound different or crazy. So it ties into all of that. Most of us who were leaders who've done anything significant in this industry. We have taken our work home right there, sometimes in the middle of the night when we're sleeping good at three in the morning. Oh no, we're thinking about this thing. Not because we want to, this is how we're wired and it's what we do. And sometimes the best side. Come visit. Right? So it's allowing that part, you know, we won't tell people not to do that. Yeah. Go home and think about work all day. We love it. And we'll celebrate that. Oh, that shit thinks about work all the time. She's amazing. Like, yeah. Yeah. So I think that's great. I think that totally is how we get it done. It's a part of it, for sure. So I give our, the L and M family out there, a pre-qual to the next year's Congress in, in new Orleans, I've seen, you know, there's been emails bouncing back and forth. And I think you mentioned like a, a theme or a message around one project, one team. Did I get that right? You did. Yeah. That's a, that's something that I'm going to be. Talking about a lot more in 20, 22 and moving forward, because I think that's really what it's about. It's, it's really, we we've done the one project and trying to get people that come from different, different unions or, or different, you know, companies and trying to create that one project, like spirit on this team. Like one way that we get people to, to effectively collaborate and communicate and work as one is promoting the one project. So it doesn't matter if you work for south Atlanta resident or whoever else it's this is one project let's put our company logo on the side and less. Create this one project mentality and that's how we do that. So it's one project, one team, and, and I really want to not, I don't even have all the answers and pieces and parts to this yet, but it's something that has strongly resonated with me and I really want to promote it more and get it out there so other people can, can build on it as well. Because I think it's what we do is what we need to do to really make the impact and keep that theme of the collaborative piece of, of, of working together. And then there's, we're stronger to get it in, you know, alone. Although it's. Probably easier to work by yourself because you don't have opinions, don't get as much done. Right. And you have to recognize that like the lone ranger doesn't get as much done as with the team, you got to have accountability. So it's, it's recognizing that that's the best way. And let's, let's prepare ourselves of how we do that in a way that we don't have to hate people, you know, and, and be discouraged about somebody else's idea and take our, our, our, our pride and, and, and all the things that we are Eagles and check them really at the door and always say that casually, but a really, what does that look like when we do that in an effective way? Where people say, yeah, this is not about me. It's about us, us, us. Yeah. You know, they say, if you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go far, go together. Correct. I, and we got a long way to go, so we need to get there together. Yeah. So Henry back, when, when your sister. We're chilling and you were out there doing, working on the cars and all that fun stuff. Loving it saying, please give me more debt. What were your career aspirations back then? And You know, I think I want it to be one point I wanted to be a doctor. I'm not sure where that came from. It was kind of a short-lived thing. I never wasn't like afraid of blood or anything. And I wanted to think, let's see my own quite a bit as a little boy growing up on stuff, you know, getting stitches. I think there was a part of me that wanted that. Then I really became focused on being an engineer and that was sent to go to school, to be an engineer, a mechanical engineer. And, and so those were the things I was always good with my hands. I thought I could kind of tie that into it. But then my dad would just check in every once in a while and say, Hey, you should think about getting the trade. And I never even thought about as a, as an option really. And when I was going to college. And I started in junior college and I was going to college for a year and he kept bugging me to just take the test. So his message was like, take the test, wasn't take the test or else it was take the test. What could it hurt? So it was kind of like, well, how do I argue with that? You're right. Does taking the test doesn't affect anything. So I took the test and obviously passed the test. And then I had to make that decision, like within a week, keep going to school, working at your, your, you know, your day job and doing that commute thing. And. Or you need to get into Trey. Like you got a week, you need to go and there's an opening for you. And it happens like now I had to figure out that I quickly, you know, and, and so obviously I went down the path of getting quitting my job in school and getting into the trade. And but I never thought that was going to be my career path. And I'm not sure why it never really came to light like that. Like, it was like I had this aspiration to be a sheet metal worker. I go into construction, even though my dad did it and right around me every day is what provided for our family. But I'm glad he had to talk with me. Cause I wasn't gonna, I wasn't gonna do that for sure. Yeah, no, that's an important story because it's, it's, it's real, right. It's your story. And you're probably not the only person that experienced that. My dad was a plumber. I got a summer job right out of high school. To save up money to pay for room and board. And when I ended up on the job site, I was like, oh my God, this is the best thing ever. Like, forget that school thing. Cause I didn't like school. I mean, I could do it, but I had to like sit down and behave and I didn't like that being on the job. So I was like, I could go work and I could cuss. And back then I used to smoke Marlboro reds it's I could smoke. And like, it was amazing. But I didn't, I didn't recognize it as a career path. Cause you know, that wasn't that wasn't part of the menu back then. And now, now there's more and more people like our friend, Steve Turner, he's an ultra marathon runner. He owns a, an upholstery business in New Hampshire. He runs bring back the trades and that's the whole thing is how do we get out there and inform people like that? The easy part, maybe it's not so easy. How do we help people become aware of a, another option in terms of a career path? Cause I mean, even you're saying like, man, I didn't, I didn't even know that was an option. It even being like being brought up in that space same thing. Right. I didn't want to do it either. Cause I remember dad, he was always, you know, he always had primary glue on his hands or you know, worked a lot hours and then, but when I actually did it, then it was like, oh, this is awesome. I'm going to keep doing it. Yeah, I think the esteem of a, a profile of what a, what a construction worker looked like was not necessarily like, oh, I want to be that person. Right. You know, you aspire, you see the doctors and the lawyers and all these other careers that you thought were cool. And that's what you were taught as a kid. So there's like, that's what you do or that's what you aspire to. But if you can't do that, you can always go into construction. Right. So it was kind of like they give us after. It wasn't a that supposedly the, the smart kid, it was for the person that couldn't go to school or didn't want to go to school. And so it had this, it didn't have an allure to it. It was more like the second guest thing and you didn't have parents promoting it. And I think that's what we do now and how we raise the awareness because we're playing catch up when it comes to getting the construction industry, the fill in the voids that we have now with the labor shortages. It's really, when I think the parents have to be educated as much as the kids and the schools in regards to, you need to make this an option for your, for your children and not as an option. Well, for the person that just isn't smart, but it's, it's really raising the awareness and the esteem and the profile of what, what I call up construction professional. Yes, sure. That's what we do. And the amount of money that runs through our hands and responsible for in a career. Is, is millions and more for some, depending on the size projects that you're going to be a part of in your career. So you are definitely a professional, you're definitely an expert and you definitely have a talent and a skill that doesn't just show up because you decide you want to do it. It's the work that you've put behind that for years, then you have a crap that I'm on a scale that, that is sought after. all the things we we're trying to, to to create and help people become more exposed to as the people side of this business, all those moving parts of how do we build a building, you know, and do these things and work with all these teams and have all this materials show up and get it installed in a timely fashion and safely. And like you got the mountain stat that isn't that stumble. You just pull up the street and say, Hey, do you want to do this? No work, tenacity, skillset, education, knowledge marts, and being a professional. So there's not like this is not the easiest. And it's, it's an amazing career as you know, and an opportunity for someone that's excited, you know, if that's what they want to do, there's no way you up way of feeling like, wow, I wish I would have been a doctor or I wish I would have been a lawyer. It's not, you are a construction professional contributing to society in this way, building great structures and this dynamic industry, like how cool is it to be a part of that? Like, there's nothing we can dismiss about an industry and say what stands in comparison to some other business? No, we, we are here and, and we, we, we move things and, and we are here to create and, and, and use our professionalism and skill sets to do this dynamic work. And that's cool stuff. Big, I mean, a hundred, hundred percent entry. You know, when I started the, I was like, oh, this is cool. When I look back and, and all the damn things that I had to learn and, and really. Break. My thinking, like learn how to connect with people, learn how to listen to if you want. I'm still trying to learn that learn how to serve people and, and, and guide them into their own self-discovery and out of their comfort zones. Like all of that. I don't think people think of that when they think of a construction worker, but you're dead, right? It, it, it, we are construction professionals and, and one I'm grateful to you. And I applaud you for being a phenomenal representative of the construction professionals out there, the image to the youth out there and to the parents and to the educators, to be able to see and hear your story and understand that what you've contributed and what you continue to contribute is going to change minds. So thank you for, for, for being you Henry. It's a big. Thank you. I agree. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yes. So, so now we're going to get into the, the the uncomfortable spot of the conversation, which is, you know, you've been at it 34 years. You've got years and years of experience. I'm sure you've tried many things that maybe didn't work out or turned into like really dumb, goofy ideas. I mean, that's my story for sure. So I'm wondering for the L and M family out there, what is a. A significant learning that you've had. That was the result of a painful misstep. Yeah. Yeah. I have a lot. But when that, that stands out the most for me, cause it was a daunting day at Southland for me. All right. Y'all we got a bit of a change here. Yes. I'm breaking up the flow and that's not going to change. It's going to stay the same, but the L and M family has spoken out and we've heard you loud and clear. What we're doing is the backstage passes. These clips that you're not going to be able to listen to on this audio version are now going to be available to everybody. On our YouTube channel. So hit up our YouTube channel, subscribe, follow, like hit all the buttons and, and give yourself a little bit of it. Uh, learnings and missteps marathon and catch up on all the outtakes. We want to hear your comments, and we want to know what you're learning from these things, because all of our guests have shared some pretty intimate, uh, missteps and have had some pretty profound learnings. And we hope that you. Take that and apply that going forward and even teach it to, to your people, the people you care about. So that is going to be the deal going forward. Thank you for supporting us and back to the show. the extra stuff is a lesson learned, you know, and you continue to learn and grow and develop. You get it right. Sometimes. And others, you still miss it, but you still take responsibility, you know, it's still like recognizing, okay. Yeah. This is. This is me and, and, and, and you own that, and this is one of the hardest things to do, you know, but it's when you get, when you practice that it, and you do it, you know, you just recognize that this is, this is what I do. You know, I, this is my responsibility. No one else should have to own this it's me. And then that's really important. And again, it's not, it's not a comfortable place to be, but, but it's, it's really, it's respectful to, and when you do it and people see that, and again, if you want to exemplify the qualities that you want others to practice, then you have to show them how that, how that's done. And, and in our industry, again, that's not something that we do very well. We can pass that buck. And you had no idea you were being done under the bus and ran over over 10 times. You had no idea until one day, they're handing you a check, you know, and you're like, what happened? You know, you were this vehicle, but you just figured it out right now. It's the last to find out. But yeah, I mean, again, big point, right? Ownership. When we take ownership of this, of our contribution. Cause we play a role in all the success and finger that we experience. And when we take ownership of our, part of that, all of a sudden we got power to change it. We have power to influence it, but if you don't take ownership, you know, you end up washing your hands with other people's careers and that's, that's not leadership. Right. And it's horrible. So I heard a rumor that, that you're working on a book Henry, is that true? That is true. This is a this is a ten-year mission. Know it's not, it's not even the lung book really is purposely not a human lung weight because of the focus. But yeah, I have a, again, part of a package. One of the things that I've been able to do with Southland for like about 12 years is go into pre-apprenticeship programs. And primarily, primarily it was about different job goals we've had and, and getting resident hiring and getting the diverse, you know, diverse applicants involved in the industry. And how do we do that? You know, so we had a job that, that had these mandates and stipulations. And so at that time it was okay, we gotta do this because we're supposed to, then the job got put on hold. And then my construction manager said, let's keep doing this because this is just the right thing to do for us. And so it opened the door for me to get an partnering with some local nonprofit organizations in the different cities we've worked in with, particularly in San Francis. There was an organization called city bill that brings in applicants, maybe a hundred at a time. And maybe 40 are selected to go through this program for 18 weeks and they get exposed to obvious different industries, different companies, partner with them to do workshops, whether it's flooring or welding or typing, plumbing, sheet metal, all those things, electrical work. And so we did, we committed to do this on a quarterly basis. And so we would bring in a team like a couple of shot people, a couple of field leaders, and we would go up into their classroom and answer questions probably for an hour, maybe longer at times because they had so many questions. And basically we bring in our leaders since. Let's tell them what the day in the life looks like in your eyes as an, as, as, as a superintendent or as a gen four person, show them and tell them what you would want them to do if they were hired by you. And so they get to ask all these different questions and, and when I would speak, I always find myself talking about these seven things, you know, and to the point where I did it for so long that I would get introduced by their staff, Hey, Henry's going to talk about these seven things, you know, and they kind of align the really basic things in my mind. But again, what I've learned at common sense is not common. And you don't always, you know, the things that you've learned in your childhood, from your parents, not everyone got that, not everyone got that class. And you, and you realize that when you're in the field, working around the shops, working, and you've got people who just don't know the basics. And all you can do is get frustrated, fire them and get somebody else that does the same thing. I'm going to have people show up with flip flops on, on a construction site and they didn't know any better and it's easy to throw that person away. But again, they don't have some of the basics that we think that are just common. So that was, that message was, was something that I did so much that I decided, you know what, I'm going to write a book about this. And, and, and so again, 10 years later, because it should have been done forever ago. It went from like, I actually went from like four or five things to seven things. And it's actually officially called seven principles creating a success in the construction industry in this design to. Work people who work with, with folks who are trying to get into this industry and probably come from diverse backgrounds, don't have necessarily an uncle nephew or an aunt or somebody who's in the industry that can help them navigate through this industry. They have no one, so they don't know some of the basics and they find themselves starting and stopping. I've had people steal from us that we brought from his programs. Right. And like, dude, you had a job, like you had a career you're getting paid weekly and you decided to steal product from us to make an extra, extra dime, like who does that and why? Right. But it's a mentality and they just don't see it. So it's taking the time on to educate people, to be successful. The basics that we think everyone knows they don't. So think things like of living like a victim for your whole life. Right. And you got people who come from diverse backgrounds that didn't have certain things. Right. So it was easy. To be victimized. It's easy to stay in that mentality of, well, I can't do it because, and then you'd get an audience that will agree with you and rally around that victimization mentality, right? Yeah. So it's the vicious cycle. So it's really coming to create. And like I say, it's, it's not even a, I would say it's not, it's not a, it's a book, but it's really more of a manual because I know that this audience doesn't want to read the novel about construction. They want something they want, they want it quick precise information. So I kind of began with with telling my own story about, about my entry into the trade, about my dad, about work that. And then break down these seven things. And so that's what, hopefully we're, we're at the final stages where I'm going to get it sent out for a few folks to review it and give me some recommendations in the book. And then we're our goal was to have it by the end of January, but I'm thinking there's probably going to be more like February mail but very excited about it. It's forcing me to do like a professional photo head shoot and do all this stuff that I wouldn't normally not do. Right. But it's been really a cool experience. So I've talked to folks like Joe and Kion who obviously, you know, put up other to review it for me. They're all for it. So you know, you've got folks, Jason, who does, who does his book and stuff, this guy Philippe. So all these, all these, these different people that we've mentioned earlier that are kind of like, you know, taking this whole thing to a different level and contributing to the industry and their own unique giftings and talents, which is really awesome. And so that is, that is my piece is really working on that, that group that is trying to get, trying to get in. They represent those labor pool that can help fill the voids that we need, but we got to help them be successful. And I don't take it lightly that it's easy. So instead of complaining, instead of bitching about why they can't and what they need to do, but not offering any. I want to offer some solutions. I want to help. I want to partner with more of these nonprofit organizations around the country and put this manual in their hand and say, Hey, let me come in and help you, help your team be more successful and heal by the way. Yeah. I've been in the industry too. And by the way, yeah, I don't know how hard it could be. Yeah. By the way, I want it to quit at one time, all these things. Right. So it was like, I'm not talking about it from the space of theory. I'm talking about it from the space of I've been there, done that. And another struggle, Henry, that is the most powerful thing that I am starting to recognize. Is there, there are some people that speak from theory and, and speak from something that they studied or watched or heard about. And that's not bad. Right. But the people that speak from their experience can offer. A whole different level of guidance. And I applaud you for, for sharing your experience because you've been out there, you done put that damn duct sealant on and went home with it all over your stuff, all over your hair, all your like, you know and, and it's those things that people don't know if they haven't lived it, they don't really know. And you can help advise so like generations to come. Dude. That is so awesome, man. Okay. The last big question. Simple question, right? Nothing, nothing too big. What footprint do you intend to leave on the world, Henry? You know that that's going to say that's not that's those, those, those little, little questions. That's probably the one for me that took me the most time there really, because I don't want to throw out some answer. And that's, that's one that challenges you to really think about. What you're doing, because, cause this is really about what you're doing now. And then, and then that opens doors for all these other things. And so I thought about that, like, like what, what do I want, what kind of footprint do I want to leave when the world I think it ties into what I said earlier. And it's, it's really about, I'll say I'll put it like this, I'll start it with saying, wanting people to recognize that what is possible. Isn't the possibility without intention, without hard work, without faith, without grit and hope and, and all these things that need to align to make that possibility possible. It's great to have an idea and a thought to want to get something done. But it's just a great idea and a thought that will never come into fruition without the work, without the alignment, without the partnerships, without the people that can rally behind you, family, community, colleagues, whatever they may be. But it's, it's, it's 20 people to showing up in your whole self is a part of that equation and making things possible. It's, it's easy to look at someone who's been successful and think that it was like a microwave kind of event last night, right? It was a cooking thing outside at 250 degrees that took eight hours. Right. Whatever it is, it's not a fast thing. And there's work behind it. But in order to really do that. And I think we've all kind of learned that because we done it wrong more often than we've done it. Right. But once we figure out how to do it, then we don't want to go back to that old way that we know the end result is hitting a brick wall. It's, it's helping that, that, that, that small voice, that person that doesn't think they can accomplish it, that can find more ways and excuses why they can't do it, then, then believe in that they can. So it's, it's, it's leaving the impression of, of wanting you to see that, listen, that heart and mind and spirit of yours, doesn't just drop in there for no reason that there is that there's a possibility now, how do you get there? So you may not have the talent necessarily. You think you may not have the connections, the people that rally behind you, but you can start with your ID. And believe in that. So I want to be that, that person that motivates and encourages people in primarily the ones that have been disadvantaged, primarily the ones that don't have the silver spoon, they don't have the connections, they just have a thought and they have a belief and they have faith. And so it's, it's, it's I think when I look at all that I've done in my life, not just professional, but in my life, it's always been rallying around the person that didn't have the voice that didn't necessarily have that, that arsenal of stuff to support their effort. And, and, and I think that's, that's, that's what I do. That's what I've done. And I think that will continue to do so. I want to invest the impression that I want to leave on people is that you can do it right. And I, I say, I'll end it with this. I was me and my son. He's a, he's a LeBron fan. And we bought in talking about Curry, you know, I'm in the bay area. So of course I love the warriors and watching Curry hit this, this shot and how amazing to get them the break, this record for three pointers. And I was driving with him the other day. And I said, you know, I said, think about that record and how significant it is, the fact that how many games, less, that he did to get there. I said that was like hard work that no one sees it. Wasn't just, oh, he's an amazing guy on the field, out there, out the, you know, in the field essentially. But think about all that he's done to get there. I said that record is going to take a long time for someone to break. I said, but there is a four year old kid somewhere around right now that whose dad or mom is working on those free throws and those shot those shots. Right. I said, so that's where it begins. It's, it's someone that believes in enough to put in that kind of. And, and, but the first piece of that is believing. I can be that I can be that man. I can be that woman that can change our industry that can really transform how we do work every day. It doesn't have to be what it's been, because it's been that way. I can create something that's transform how this interview does work, how we approach our work. We can be vulnerable. We can be tough. We can, we can be calm. We can, we can still have conflict, but we don't have to kill each other emotionally or physically. When we have those kinds of issues, we can do it differently and raise the esteem of our industry. So people say, you know what? Dr. Lawyer constructs professional. That's all in my plethora of ideas, that construction is not on the outside anymore. It's not a part of a conversation at my table when I'm talking to my family. You know, it's what my parents advocate. No, not just these other things. I can go to school for four or five years as the apprentice and come out with something that creates a career path for me that I enjoy and love. So it's, it's really that whole kind of thing, creating people that, that just bring our industry to the limelight but have faith hope and tenacity and know that they can make a difference. And, and sometimes it comes from the ones that are least likely like me. Yeah. Henry, I'll say this amazing. You inspire me for whatever that's worth. I know the first time I heard you speak at LCI Congress, like, Ooh, It was a, and that was way before I started, like even using that was back when I just used like Facebook to post dumb stuff before I even really kind of got serious on LinkedIn and being able to see you. And what's significant about what you said was the question that we asked, made you think about what are you doing right now? And so I've been able to see you consistently going down that path, laying down that path, clearing that path and, and on with a crazy idea, but that you believe in. And, and I think what's what, or our L and M family out there is. You're laying the path of your future right now, right now. And whatever that idea or hope. It's like a fart in the wind, unless you take action about it. What are you doing about it? And there's amazing. People like Henry out there that want to equip people with the resources or insights to actualize their, their hopes and their dreams. Henry, you're an amazing human being, man. I appreciate you spending so much time with us today, Jessie, I thank you. And I just appreciate the fact, the view. Again, you have this, you've created this space and have allow people like myself and Jennifer and Adam and Jason Lee bay, and so many more to kind of canvas our ideas and realize how, how much we're alike and how much we're trying to do in the same light, again, different perspective. But this is closet ideas and thoughts, and you create up this space, which will help transform our industry because it really, really matters. And we know that this message needs to get out there and it is part of that transformation transfer transformation happening. So thank you for your leadership and what you've created. I look forward to, to, you know, more of it and, and being a part of it. So again, I applaud your effort here to thank you, brother. Welcome. Oh man. Didn't I tell you that you were going to be motivated and moved in some kind of way. Henry just has a flow about him and a real new. And earnestness and purpose in every word that he chooses and amazing human being. I'm looking forward to getting some selfies with them at LCI Congress in new Orleans. Uh, y'all y'all wanna meet some super cool people that are really focused in changing the industry. Come on out to Congress in new Orleans. We're going to have some fun out there. And so now it is time for our shout-out from an L and M family member. That's given us some feedback. this one comes from the boom diesel, which is a pretty slick name. I wish I knew who that was. Cause it as cool man, the boom diesel. Here we go. Boom. Bizzle says, I love this podcast. The straight talk is authentic, vulnerable and transplant. We need more of these kinds of discussions. Boom, dizzle. Thank you. Because yeah, that's, that's what we're here for, uh, to have some real conversation and to be a human beings that we are, we take off the Polish and, and, and show up as our full selves. That's what we're here for. That's what you guys help us continue to do before we go, y'all have been amazing supporters of this effort. We were past 15 months, which is a pretty big mark for any podcast. And, and it's, it's actually turned, it's turning into something bigger and things continue to grow for us. And so what I'm going to ask you to do is take some time and go to LinkedIn or YouTube and follow no B S with Jen and Jess. That's coming out big, start in January 8th, Saturday at 8:00 AM. You want to be there. You might want to bring some tissues maybe in, in a, in a notebook, uh, because it gets pretty serious. We talk about real things, my life, her life, and we really want to change the perspective. So we start talking about. The human side of things, Henry touched on it, right? Where we, we have omitted the human beings, the real, the power behind all things that are happening, our people. And Jen and I are going to be talking about these things, talking about reality, and we invite you in to get a glimpse of our lives and contribute and help us all learn and grow together. So be cool. And we'll talk at your next.