May 8, 2025

Building Bridges, Not Walls: Kimberly Sauceda on Connection and Leadership

What happens when only one side builds a relationship? You end up with a lookout, not a bridge. This profound realization forms the heart of my conversation with Kimberly Sauceda, bestselling author of "Meet Me at the Bridge" and a relationship expert with over 20 years of experience working with organizations like Apple. Kimberly shares the touching origin story behind her bridge-building philosophy - a spontaneous moment with her teenage son during COVID lockdown that crystallized the trut...

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Season 3

What happens when only one side builds a relationship? You end up with a lookout, not a bridge. This profound realization forms the heart of my conversation with Kimberly Sauceda, bestselling author of "Meet Me at the Bridge" and a relationship expert with over 20 years of experience working with organizations like Apple.

Kimberly shares the touching origin story behind her bridge-building philosophy - a spontaneous moment with her teenage son during COVID lockdown that crystallized the truth about mutual relationship investment. "Hi mama, I'm here to build a bridge," he said, mirroring her own approach and revealing the essential nature of two-sided connection.

We explore how leaders unknowingly "pluck the feathers of eagles," transforming potential high-performers into disengaged team members through dismissive behaviors and unclear expectations. As Kimberly wisely notes, "unset expectations are predetermined disappointment." The bridge metaphor extends beyond the workplace into all human connections, offering a framework built on trust, respect, and genuine interest in others.

The conversation takes a fascinating turn when we discuss conflict's crucial role in relationship building. Rather than viewing conflict as something to avoid, Kimberly reframes it as an opportunity to strengthen connections through curiosity and listening. High-trust teams are five times more productive precisely because they can navigate disagreement effectively.

For those working under limiting leadership, Kimberly offers practical strategies: decide who you want to be regardless of circumstances, find alternative sources for validation, and develop a personal "board of directors" for perspective and support. This approach maintains integrity while strategically working toward roles where your contributions are valued.

Ready to transform your professional and personal relationships? Start by asking yourself which bridges you're building and whether you're inviting others to build alongside you. Check out Kimberly's book and leadership programs at fromO2U.com to learn how to move from overwhelmed to unstoppable through the power of connection.

Connect with Kimberly at:

https://fromo2u.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/kimberlysauceda/

Make yourself a priority and get more done: https://www.depthbuilder.com/do-the-damn-thing

Download a PDF copy of Becoming the Promise You are Intended to Be
https://www.depthbuilder.com/books

00:00 - Bridge Building Requires Two Sides

05:40 - The Universal Principles of Relationships

13:40 - Managing Up: More Than Playing the Game

20:21 - Trust: The Foundation of High-Performing Teams

27:02 - Conflict as a Path to Better Relationships

36:30 - Rebuilding Trust After Damaged Relationships

46:20 - The Importance of Connection in Leadership

56:28 - From Overwhelmed to Unstoppable: Creating Bridges

WEBVTT

00:00:00.059 --> 00:00:01.965
Hi Mama, I'm here to build a bridge.

00:00:02.829 --> 00:00:03.189
Oh, wow.

00:00:03.580 --> 00:00:11.814
And that was the moment that I realized oh, if it's a bridge, both sides have to build.

00:00:11.814 --> 00:00:14.285
If you're in one side building.

00:00:14.285 --> 00:00:15.689
You just have a lookout.

00:00:16.300 --> 00:00:20.487
But I'm surrounded by turkeys and you're not surrounded by turkeys.

00:00:20.487 --> 00:00:24.544
You just plucked the feathers of all the eagles around you.

00:00:24.544 --> 00:00:27.707
Turkeys, you just plucked the feathers of all the eagles around you.

00:00:27.707 --> 00:00:30.268
What is going on?

00:00:30.268 --> 00:00:31.971
L&m family?

00:00:31.971 --> 00:00:37.475
I've got a good one and like, of course, I'm getting like a double dose of awesomeness.

00:00:45.320 --> 00:00:49.270
I've been able to have a conversation and I know we're going to have future conversations with our guest today who is an expert in building high performing relationships.

00:00:49.270 --> 00:00:54.883
She's got over 20 years of experience working with top tier companies like Apple.

00:00:54.883 --> 00:01:08.623
So like super, super fancy, real, legit, highly accomplished individual who now partners with leaders, teams and organizations to optimize their relationships for unstoppable results.

00:01:08.623 --> 00:01:14.073
And she's also a best-selling author of Meet Me at the Bridge.

00:01:14.073 --> 00:01:20.921
So if you're not intimidated, I need to let y'all know out there I'm a little bit intimidated over you, except that she's super awesome.

00:01:20.921 --> 00:01:27.331
So you're going to get to meet Ms Kimberly Sauceda here in a second, if this is your first time here.

00:01:27.331 --> 00:01:40.569
This is the Learnings and Missteps podcast, where you get to see how real people just like you are sharing their gifts and talents to leave this world better than they found it.

00:01:40.569 --> 00:01:45.626
I'm Jesse, your selfish servant, and we about to get to know Miss Kimberly.

00:01:45.626 --> 00:01:47.701
Miss Kimberly, how are you?

00:01:48.563 --> 00:01:51.531
I'm great, Jesse, and I've been looking forward to this.

00:01:51.531 --> 00:01:53.361
I'm excited for us to chat today.

00:01:54.304 --> 00:01:56.447
Oh, my goodness, and you got a lot going on.

00:01:56.447 --> 00:02:01.066
I know you do, and so I'm grateful to you for gifting us with this time.

00:02:01.066 --> 00:02:10.675
I know that it's going to, if it doesn't at least rev some people's engines, it will at least start a few fires in people to get moving and get going.

00:02:10.675 --> 00:02:18.902
And so I was looking at the stuff, kind of stalking you a little bit on the socials, and I said, oh, I got a nice question I want to open up with.

00:02:19.163 --> 00:02:19.524
Okay.

00:02:20.545 --> 00:02:25.052
I mentioned in the intro, there's a lot of language about relationships.

00:02:29.723 --> 00:02:30.525
So are we talking about dating?

00:02:30.525 --> 00:02:31.687
Oh well, here's the funny thing.

00:02:31.687 --> 00:02:49.325
So no, this is what I've been talking about are work relationships, and so the idea is building a bridge and that both sides have to build the bridge.

00:02:49.325 --> 00:03:14.189
However, here's the funny thing is I have spoken at dozens of companies and talk now to thousands and thousands of people, and here's what happens afterwards Inevitably, somebody comes up to me and they're like this idea of a bridge, it actually works for all your relationships, because I talk about a foundation of trust, respect and connection, and they're like it works really well with my kids, which is amazing, because that's actually how the whole thing started.

00:03:14.189 --> 00:03:22.126
And then people also say it works really well with your significant other, too, and I'm like it does.

00:03:22.126 --> 00:03:42.163
In fact, and you know the other bridge that I'm starting to write about and have been writing about ready it's the bridge you're going to have the longest, so it works in so many different facets, jesse, and I love that people are seeing that and coming to me and saying you need to write another book.

00:03:42.846 --> 00:03:43.407
What about this?

00:03:43.606 --> 00:03:46.013
one and saying how it's transforming their relationship.

00:03:46.013 --> 00:03:50.449
So I am super grateful and humbled with the reception of all of it.

00:03:50.569 --> 00:03:52.233
Yeah, oh, my goodness.

00:03:52.233 --> 00:04:04.360
Well, so folks, if you didn't catch it, the stuff when somebody is providing and delivering universal principles, it translates across.

00:04:04.360 --> 00:04:05.945
Of course I was being goofy.

00:04:05.945 --> 00:04:07.100
Are we talking about dating?

00:04:07.100 --> 00:04:22.182
Because the things you nailed it and I especially love little nugget here y'all the idea of this relationship with yourself, and so that's something, a project that Ms Kimberly is tinkering on right now.

00:04:22.182 --> 00:04:24.264
We're going to have to talk about that in the future.

00:04:24.264 --> 00:04:25.687
Really put that one on the shelf.

00:04:25.687 --> 00:04:30.713
But primarily, the book is based on.

00:04:30.713 --> 00:04:45.834
The bestselling book is based on relationships interdepartmentally, within the professional space, if you will, but those principles are applicable in familial relationships, in romantic relationships and so forth.

00:04:45.834 --> 00:04:46.615
Did I get that right?

00:04:46.980 --> 00:04:59.372
Yeah, that's absolutely right, absolutely yes, and there wasn't a book that really talked about employee to manager, manager to employee and how both sides really need to work together.

00:04:59.372 --> 00:05:02.005
That's the kind of the key differentiator.

00:05:02.005 --> 00:05:07.105
But this book, yes, is absolutely based on that and it can be up and down, right.

00:05:07.105 --> 00:05:09.612
So how you manage, or also how you manage up.

00:05:10.500 --> 00:05:12.687
Oh man, that's so many people.

00:05:12.687 --> 00:05:17.886
Rather, I'll say it this way I did not understand the value.

00:05:17.886 --> 00:05:30.160
First I'll say that I did not understand the value of managing up, and then I didn't understand how to do it effectively understand the value of managing up and then I didn't understand how to do it effectively.

00:05:34.579 --> 00:05:35.262
Jesse, yes, same, and I have.

00:05:35.262 --> 00:05:35.742
I have a lot of.

00:05:35.742 --> 00:05:38.492
You'll have clients or other people that'll come to me and say I don't want to play the game, but it's.

00:05:38.492 --> 00:05:40.940
I feel like there's a different reframe we can have.

00:05:40.940 --> 00:05:54.764
Instead of the idea of I don't want to play the game, there are certain things that are happening and it is the traction that you get when you have a solid relationship with someone, when you have really good trust.

00:05:54.764 --> 00:06:02.810
There are tons of studies from Harvard Business Review across the board that have been done about how important trust is.

00:06:02.810 --> 00:06:04.862
So it's not I don't know.

00:06:04.862 --> 00:06:06.562
I wouldn't look at it as like a game.

00:06:06.562 --> 00:06:07.906
You're not trying to manipulate.

00:06:07.906 --> 00:06:14.632
It's just that relationships are so much better when they're stronger than if they're just like transactional.

00:06:15.535 --> 00:06:18.803
Oh my God, totally yeah, cause transactional is disposable, right?

00:06:18.803 --> 00:06:20.086
Whatever, I'll just get another one.

00:06:20.387 --> 00:06:21.430
Yes, yes.

00:06:21.430 --> 00:06:47.497
Now, when I used to say that I don't want to play the game, looking back I can see that what I was yes, yes, I find that either that or I just want to do the work and I want somebody to be able to see the work that I'm doing.

00:06:47.497 --> 00:07:02.694
But what we don't realize is sometimes your manager has 18 other things that are happening, and so if you tell them the things that you're doing, or the things that your team's doing, you're actually enabling them to be your advocate.

00:07:02.694 --> 00:07:03.396
Right, yes?

00:07:03.675 --> 00:07:07.026
Yes, yes, yeah, and it's an uncomfortable thing.

00:07:07.026 --> 00:07:08.886
I know for me personally.

00:07:08.886 --> 00:07:14.151
A lot of people I know like advocating for yourself is uncomfortable.

00:07:14.151 --> 00:07:23.206
I know my upbringing was keep your head down, work hard, do the right thing, be polite, play fair and you will get noticed.

00:07:23.206 --> 00:07:27.269
Yes, that was true at home, not in the workplace.

00:07:27.620 --> 00:07:29.283
Right, yes.

00:07:30.084 --> 00:07:37.394
Yeah, and so I have that framework going into the professional space in construction.

00:07:37.394 --> 00:07:51.357
I'm a construction guy where it's very competitive and there are some people that are very skilled at advocating for themselves and, even worse, some people that are very skilled at advocating for themselves and, even worse, some people that have made a career of taking credit for other people's work.

00:07:51.617 --> 00:07:52.557
Yes, yes.

00:07:52.598 --> 00:07:53.497
What do you think about that?

00:07:53.920 --> 00:07:56.190
I mean, that is the ultimate and frustrating.

00:07:56.190 --> 00:08:09.146
When there is somebody that is taking credit for someone else's work, or when there is someone and they like just kind of showed up and were part of the project but they didn't actually do the thing.

00:08:09.146 --> 00:08:32.250
Or I work with several people in construction and I did a whole leadership program for a construction company, and sometimes you'll have someone and the estimate will be a little bit off, or hey, they meant to do this but they didn't get around to it, and other people come in and pick up the slack, and so when reviews come, they're like well, I did this, but it's inaccurate, right.

00:08:32.591 --> 00:08:33.413
Yeah, yep.

00:08:33.700 --> 00:08:38.988
Physically there they just, but they weren't the ones solving the problems, they weren't the ones doing the other things.

00:08:38.988 --> 00:08:53.676
And so, yeah, advocating for yourself can be uncomfortable, but it's also finding that confidence and telling the story in a way that feels solid for you.

00:08:53.676 --> 00:09:02.712
So sometimes what I work with people about is what's that mindset shift so it doesn't feel like the salesy?

00:09:03.254 --> 00:09:04.701
kind of person we talk about.

00:09:04.701 --> 00:09:06.708
Okay, what is it that's holding you back?

00:09:06.708 --> 00:09:18.230
Who is it that you don't want to be and what's the story you're kind of creating about that, Because I'll bet that you maybe had something where you're like, well, I don't want to be that guy or that person.

00:09:20.701 --> 00:09:26.503
We want to do our L&M shout out, and so this shout out is going to Mr Amut.

00:09:26.503 --> 00:09:28.423
Mr Amut, you are amazing.

00:09:28.423 --> 00:09:39.731
We've been able to hang out a few times and you left me this note and I want to make sure and share it.

00:09:39.731 --> 00:09:42.734
Processes, but what about the human side?

00:09:42.734 --> 00:10:05.530
That's when I discovered the hashtag no BS Tribe, where two remarkable individuals teach people to embrace vulnerability every other Saturday morning, which led me to dive into the emotional bungee jumpers, an experience that significantly improved my communication and leadership skills.

00:10:06.039 --> 00:10:09.190
Amut, thank you for giving us the shout out.

00:10:09.190 --> 00:10:23.860
Jennifer Lacey and I we do the no BS live stream every other Saturday and you we need to make it clear, Amut you are the one who did the work to build and enhance those communication skills and leadership skills and all the other skills and folks.

00:10:23.860 --> 00:10:33.710
If you're hearing this shout out, part of the reason is to motivate you to also send me a comment, leave a review or share this conversation with your people.

00:10:33.710 --> 00:10:38.008
Especially, if you leave me a comment, that gives me the opportunity to shout you out in the future.

00:10:38.008 --> 00:10:41.023
So now we're going to get back to the conversation.

00:10:44.048 --> 00:10:59.273
Maybe something beneath that, where you can kind of you don't have to be there, but you also don't have to be not saying the things that you're doing we can come to this confident place where you can advocate and ask for the things that you want and need.

00:10:59.980 --> 00:11:03.241
Yes, you nailed it right In my head.

00:11:03.241 --> 00:11:05.222
I had a friend growing up.

00:11:05.222 --> 00:11:07.485
You remember Beaker from the Muppets?

00:11:07.485 --> 00:11:12.606
Yes, okay, yep, that's who he is in my head, because he's always me, me, me, me, me.

00:11:12.606 --> 00:11:16.309
Look at me, look at me, look at me, me, me, and I'm like fuck and everybody knew.

00:11:16.309 --> 00:11:16.730
Oh, here we go.

00:11:16.730 --> 00:11:20.032
We're gonna have to listen to him brag for 30 minutes about the same thing.

00:11:20.032 --> 00:11:22.232
He bragged about the last six times we saw him.

00:11:22.232 --> 00:11:24.134
He bragged about the last six times we saw him.

00:11:24.134 --> 00:11:29.518
So in my head, me advocating for myself, that was the guy I didn't want to be.

00:11:29.518 --> 00:11:55.440
Yes, now, but my problem, or my misstep, was that I associated any style or version of advocating for myself with the negative experience or, I'll say it clearer, the repulsing experience I had from me me me me, and so I had to peel that apart, and what I'm taking is you.

00:11:56.682 --> 00:11:58.784
Your work is in that space.

00:11:58.784 --> 00:11:59.907
Yes, yes.

00:11:59.907 --> 00:12:05.855
Okay Now, what came first, like, how did you get there?

00:12:05.855 --> 00:12:09.831
Did you write a book and then say, okay, this is how you should do it, and then you should do it?

00:12:09.831 --> 00:12:15.472
Or you were helping all these big, gigantic, awesome companies and picked up on some stuff and wrote the book.

00:12:15.472 --> 00:12:29.105
What was the sequence or the path for you to be able to have the insight to help people understand that there's nuance and layers to all of this relationship and maybe, more specifically, self-advocacy stuff?

00:12:29.846 --> 00:12:34.094
Yeah, so okay, there are three different parts to this.

00:12:34.094 --> 00:12:40.326
First, what was the kind of the genesis of had me starting to look at this?

00:12:40.326 --> 00:12:42.730
And I live in California.

00:12:42.730 --> 00:12:44.173
We were at this offsite.

00:12:44.173 --> 00:13:02.254
It was this incredible, gorgeous venue and I remember watching like the waves break against the coast as it's coming in and how peaceful that was, and being in this suite and how disruptive everything was.

00:13:02.254 --> 00:13:11.850
We were doing this vision strategy mission discussion and the person that was leading it was fire hosing everything.

00:13:12.072 --> 00:13:31.191
And it was so fascinating because this person, unintentionally, was deflating everything in the room and saying how no, that doesn't make sense, and no, we can't do this, no, we can't do this, and shutting everybody down and the poo poo party.

00:13:31.191 --> 00:13:51.647
Yes, yes, it was crazy because you had this group of very talented people and we're doing this strategy offsite and we couldn't come together with a strategy because we weren't coming together with the right strategy, according to the person leading it.

00:13:52.927 --> 00:14:09.234
And it was fascinating because on the ride home with one of the people that I was there with, I'm so interested I felt when I saw at the the time I was in marketing and I really felt like oh if I wasn't in marketing, I think I would have been a psychologist.

00:14:09.254 --> 00:14:26.038
I'm so fascinated by why people do what they do and how they do it, and so I almost was having this meta experience of watching how everybody was in that room and shutting down, and I also had had a conversation with the leader.

00:14:26.038 --> 00:14:27.059
That night.

00:14:27.059 --> 00:14:34.433
We went and we walked after a bonfire and this person was perplexed as to what happened.

00:14:34.433 --> 00:14:35.863
They're all so smart.

00:14:35.863 --> 00:14:39.169
Why are they not offering good ideas, all of the things?

00:14:39.169 --> 00:14:39.530
It was?

00:14:39.530 --> 00:14:42.804
It was this really interesting?

00:14:42.804 --> 00:14:49.330
Oh, they're unaware of what's happening, they're unaware of the ripples that they're causing.

00:14:49.330 --> 00:14:51.524
And then you know what happens.

00:14:51.524 --> 00:14:54.951
We go back and is this strategy implemented?

00:14:54.951 --> 00:15:00.385
No, because people are not on board, they're not bought in, they're not all of the things.

00:15:00.559 --> 00:15:05.971
And so that's the moment where I started thinking, okay, how do I want to be?

00:15:05.971 --> 00:15:10.068
What is it that I'm paying attention to as far as relationships?

00:15:10.068 --> 00:15:20.884
And in that moment, I was remembering back several years ago, when I very first started managing and did not do it well, and we can talk about that in a few minutes.

00:15:20.884 --> 00:15:27.000
But so that was the place where I was like, wow, okay, this went so catastrophically bad.

00:15:27.000 --> 00:15:28.484
I really want to understand it.

00:15:28.524 --> 00:15:37.153
So I spent all of this time, even before thinking about a book, even before any of the other pieces, trying to understand it, like, how do I want to show up?

00:15:37.153 --> 00:15:50.889
And I really feel like every person that you interact with has some kind of gift to offer, something that you can really take from them if you choose to see it and and and that.

00:15:50.889 --> 00:15:53.614
That was the genesis of me doing all of that.

00:15:53.614 --> 00:15:58.746
Second, I want to tell you a funny story about my sweet son.

00:15:58.746 --> 00:16:13.503
So, spring of 2021, I went into his room and, jesse, to this day I have no idea where this came from and you're totally going to laugh, being in the construction industry, and probably all of your people are going to laugh.

00:16:14.144 --> 00:16:16.109
I know this is not how a bridge is built.

00:16:16.109 --> 00:16:18.519
Okay, so we should just start with that.

00:16:18.519 --> 00:16:21.383
And I don't know where this came from, but I walk in.

00:16:21.383 --> 00:16:23.985
You have to remember spring 2021,.

00:16:23.985 --> 00:16:24.544
But I walk in.

00:16:24.544 --> 00:16:27.947
You have to remember spring 2021, it's COVID, right?

00:16:27.947 --> 00:16:30.428
Yeah, my son then is a freshman in high school.

00:16:30.428 --> 00:16:34.211
He's now finishing up his freshman year in college.

00:16:34.211 --> 00:16:49.664
I walk in, Jesse, and I go ka-ching, ka-ching ding, and he looks at me like I've lost my mind and I say, hey, sweetheart, I'm here to build a bridge.

00:16:49.664 --> 00:16:52.479
Okay, I know that's not like what anything sounds like if you're building a bridge, but we're just going to go with the analogy because I love a good analogy.

00:16:53.240 --> 00:16:55.488
And I said every day I'm going to come in.

00:16:55.488 --> 00:16:58.202
I don't want to talk to you about what your room looks like.

00:16:58.202 --> 00:16:59.443
It looked like a crazy mess.

00:16:59.443 --> 00:17:11.710
I don't want to talk to you about your grades, which, by way, we're amazing, like super yeah but I feel like we're disconnected and I really want us to have a great bridge.

00:17:11.930 --> 00:17:14.823
So every morning I was coming in I was just asking him questions.

00:17:14.823 --> 00:17:16.768
He's a catcher, he plays baseball.

00:17:16.768 --> 00:17:22.426
What's it like to to kind of have lunch on zoom with your baseball buddies?

00:17:22.426 --> 00:17:24.490
It's your, your freshman year.

00:17:24.490 --> 00:17:25.573
What's it like?

00:17:25.573 --> 00:17:27.523
Like how are you doing Just?

00:17:27.523 --> 00:17:29.107
How are you doing in general?

00:17:29.107 --> 00:17:30.471
How are your friends Like?

00:17:30.471 --> 00:17:31.141
What are you finding?

00:17:31.141 --> 00:17:33.247
Just connection questions, what?

00:17:33.267 --> 00:17:38.547
do you want to be in 20 years, just whatever, anything that kind of popped into my mind.

00:17:38.547 --> 00:17:47.174
We just have a 15 minute conversation, okay, literally the next week, jesse, this thing it still gets me.

00:17:47.174 --> 00:17:55.353
He walks into my bedroom, which was also my office at the time, and he goes ka-ching, ka-ching, ding.

00:17:55.353 --> 00:17:57.941
Hi, mama, I'm here to build a bridge.

00:17:58.821 --> 00:17:59.241
Oh, wow.

00:17:59.583 --> 00:18:02.084
And that was the moment that I realized.

00:18:02.084 --> 00:18:07.828
That was the moment that I realized, oh, if it's a bridge, both sides have to build.

00:18:07.828 --> 00:18:10.289
If you're on one side building.

00:18:10.289 --> 00:18:11.692
You just have a lookout.

00:18:11.692 --> 00:18:19.277
Yep, that was the moment where I was like this this is a thing that people in organizations need to know.

00:18:19.537 --> 00:18:19.757
Yes.

00:18:25.920 --> 00:18:27.826
This is a thing that is going to be a game changer, because so often you just have one side.

00:18:27.826 --> 00:18:46.152
That's like trying, trying, trying, but if you don't have the other side, you're just, you're not building that bridge and so that's when I started really thinking about it, introducing it to the coaching that I was doing, introducing it to workshops, and then, several months later, did I start actually writing a book about it.

00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:47.902
Got you.

00:18:47.902 --> 00:18:52.093
So you observed it the disconnect.

00:18:52.093 --> 00:18:54.680
You observed the disconnect in the strategy session.

00:18:54.680 --> 00:19:10.625
Which folks I'm willing to bet every LNM family member out there listening to this has been to an annual strategy retreat, and more than one, and the best takeaway was the place they went was awesome.

00:19:10.625 --> 00:19:17.342
It was fun, because the deployment of the strategy rarely, rarely happens.

00:19:18.123 --> 00:19:19.944
And how do I say this?

00:19:19.944 --> 00:19:28.215
To use your story with your son In my head, it's a perfect picture of why he was reciprocating.

00:19:28.215 --> 00:19:30.825
It wasn't because you told him to.

00:19:30.825 --> 00:19:35.546
It wasn't because you said I'm going to build a bridge, I'm going to do my half, you need to do your half.

00:19:35.546 --> 00:19:43.448
It was because you demonstrated the behavior of what bridge building looks like.

00:19:43.508 --> 00:20:03.471
You would go to him, have a conversation of your curiosities and your interest in him as a human being, not how he's performing as your son or as a student A conversation and interest of him being a human being which planted a seed for him to do the same.

00:20:03.471 --> 00:20:20.109
And so, going back to, like the strategy sessions and I'm sure you've, I know that you've done bazillions and seen this over and over again I've been in a situation where the boss is telling everybody how it needs to be what it needs to look like, what shape, what tone, what font, la la la.

00:20:20.109 --> 00:20:30.667
And they say and I want this to be a safe and collaborative space, collaborate and people are like, as long as it's my idea.

00:20:30.988 --> 00:20:32.991
I love the collaboration.

00:20:33.512 --> 00:20:41.579
There's no bridge there right, and so there's no invitation of hey, come contribute to this yes and then there's frustration.

00:20:41.579 --> 00:20:44.005
Yes, because they're not contributing.

00:20:44.005 --> 00:20:51.188
It's like how can I soar with the eagles when I'm surrounded by turkeys and you're not surrounded by turkeys?

00:20:51.188 --> 00:20:56.509
You just plucked the feathers of all the eagles around you because of the way you behave.

00:20:56.990 --> 00:20:57.391
That's right.

00:20:58.492 --> 00:20:58.772
Yeah.

00:20:59.775 --> 00:21:01.605
Yes, it's exactly right.

00:21:01.605 --> 00:21:04.567
Have you heard of the jar with the fleas?

00:21:04.567 --> 00:21:09.268
Yes, right, and they'll jump up and jump up, and jump up and jump up.

00:21:09.268 --> 00:21:14.686
But if you put the lid on, then they don't continue to jump as high.

00:21:14.686 --> 00:21:22.781
And then, when you take the lid off, they still don't jump as high because they've been trained not to.

00:21:22.781 --> 00:21:36.987
And sometimes leaders end up training their teams that hey, I know, I say that things that you're doing, so people's capabilities, how do you help me?

00:21:37.067 --> 00:22:16.782
And now I believe, and I really do, wholeheartedly want them to excel and share all their creativity, all their critical thinking.

00:22:16.782 --> 00:22:21.633
But because of the way I function, I'm suffocating that.

00:22:21.633 --> 00:22:23.482
How do you help me?

00:22:23.482 --> 00:22:28.903
Like a couple of pointers you would give to a stubborn, blind person like me.

00:22:29.964 --> 00:22:54.509
Yeah, so we talk about what potential impact could be If we've done a 360, it's even easier because then we see blind spots and we have discussions with stakeholders that we've said hey, here's some of the things that are coming up and here's the impact that you're having, because we all have great intentions, but we sometimes have impact that we don't realize.

00:22:54.509 --> 00:23:02.949
It's that imagine you're a speedboat and as you're going by, there are all these ripples and they're affecting everyone else, right?

00:23:03.108 --> 00:23:03.289
Yes.

00:23:03.559 --> 00:23:08.548
You're not aware of what your wake is, You're still responsible for your wake.

00:23:08.548 --> 00:23:15.450
So one of the things that I talk about is what's the potential wake that you're causing there?

00:23:15.450 --> 00:23:17.192
Right Potential?

00:23:17.212 --> 00:23:17.413
Yes.

00:23:18.114 --> 00:23:20.665
Unintended, but what is it?

00:23:20.665 --> 00:23:25.152
So we try to jump into what the other person might be thinking or feeling.

00:23:25.152 --> 00:23:27.042
Yeah, I hear you.

00:23:27.042 --> 00:23:31.393
It does sound really frustrating that they're not coming to you with ideas.

00:23:31.393 --> 00:23:35.228
What might be behind some of that?

00:23:35.228 --> 00:23:44.488
Oh okay, so when you're talking about doing strategy sessions, how is it that you are asking for them to come to the table?

00:23:44.488 --> 00:23:48.095
And I drill down to when are you bringing your ideas?

00:23:48.095 --> 00:23:48.941
When?

00:23:48.980 --> 00:23:49.261
are they?

00:23:49.321 --> 00:24:00.993
bringing their ideas, because if it is somebody that is just coming to the table and they already know what their ideas are and you know they're doing active listening.

00:24:00.993 --> 00:24:02.395
That's not active listening.

00:24:04.461 --> 00:24:07.109
Oh, don't even get me started on that.

00:24:08.560 --> 00:24:15.413
So we basically peel back the onion and I would say to all your listeners what is it?

00:24:15.413 --> 00:24:18.605
What assumptions are you making about people?

00:24:18.767 --> 00:24:19.106
Are you?

00:24:19.248 --> 00:24:22.173
assuming that they don't have great ideas.

00:24:22.173 --> 00:24:30.346
Okay, well, what led you to believe that and how might some of the stuff that you're doing have some kind of impact on that?

00:24:30.346 --> 00:24:37.808
And if you go to the table thinking that they have great ideas, you're actually going to be acting differently.

00:24:37.808 --> 00:24:44.671
How do you encourage those great ideas and how do you encourage the implementation of those great ideas?

00:24:44.851 --> 00:24:47.786
Because, here's the fascinating thing that's happening right now.

00:24:47.786 --> 00:24:52.401
We're in this economy where people are really nervous.

00:24:52.401 --> 00:25:02.036
Right, there have been layoffs, trust is really low and there is not a ton of transparency.

00:25:02.036 --> 00:25:11.349
There's a lot of uncertainty, and so a lot of organizations are moving to more performance and accountability metrics, and I get it.

00:25:11.349 --> 00:25:19.073
However, we also need to have the human capital metrics, because companies also are saying there's not a lot of innovation.

00:25:19.073 --> 00:25:28.469
Well, how are you making it okay for people to Experiment Fail, yes, but that's exactly right to experiment.

00:25:28.469 --> 00:25:36.171
What are you encouraging and how are you doing that, both with the mindset that you're coming in and the things that you're doing?

00:25:36.852 --> 00:25:38.013
Yes, oh, I love it.

00:25:38.013 --> 00:25:54.023
So two things I want to Three things the experiment the reason I like the word experiment is because failure is inherent in that exercise, because I'm going to run multiple experiments to get the outcome that I want.

00:25:54.244 --> 00:25:54.465
Yes.

00:25:54.826 --> 00:26:12.511
I cannot experiment if failure is, if there's a punitive response to failure in experimentation which is very different than failing or refusing to comply with the roles and responsibilities that I've signed up for.

00:26:12.511 --> 00:26:14.784
Those are two different things 100% yes.

00:26:15.085 --> 00:26:21.534
Yes, but it's easy to like, co-mingle them or me being the limiter, the limiting leader.

00:26:21.534 --> 00:26:26.602
My behavior signals to people and I love that you like the wake.

00:26:26.602 --> 00:26:32.846
I am responsible for the impact of the weight, even though I can't see it Like for me.

00:26:32.846 --> 00:26:41.490
The biggest struggle I had was I didn't understand that, like in my head, I'm still a skinny, troublemaking plumber from the South side.

00:26:41.490 --> 00:26:44.751
I'm not skinny anymore, I'm still a troublemaker.

00:26:44.751 --> 00:26:56.077
So as I got promoted into different roles and levels of the organization, I didn't understand that my title amplified my behaviors and my words.

00:26:56.397 --> 00:26:56.698
Yes.

00:26:56.958 --> 00:27:10.299
And it took a long time for me to really take ownership of like, hey, dummy, don't say dumb things, because you're giving people permission to say and do dumb things Anyhow.

00:27:10.299 --> 00:27:11.782
I know not everybody has that problem, but I did so.

00:27:11.782 --> 00:27:12.463
That was the second point.

00:27:12.463 --> 00:27:25.513
Now, in terms of seeing the issue like the 360 survey folks, if you don't know what a 360 is, is it's a survey that like, let's say again, I'm the limiting leader.

00:27:25.513 --> 00:27:30.327
Everybody not my bosses they're going to get surveyed.

00:27:30.327 --> 00:27:34.605
The customers external to the organization, they're going to get surveyed.

00:27:34.605 --> 00:27:46.226
The people that report to me that I'm the boss of, they're going to get surveyed and it'll give me information from that demographic or that perspective of the stakeholders.

00:27:46.226 --> 00:27:47.307
So I get to see.

00:27:47.710 --> 00:27:50.281
And here's like the first time you want to guess what happened to me.

00:27:50.281 --> 00:27:51.464
The first time is Kimberly.

00:27:51.464 --> 00:27:55.751
My bosses were very pleased with me.

00:27:55.751 --> 00:28:00.188
Everybody else hated me Cause.

00:28:00.188 --> 00:28:00.729
Guess what?

00:28:00.729 --> 00:28:07.228
All of my focus and effort and energy was on self-preservation and pleasing the bosses.

00:28:07.228 --> 00:28:12.147
I wasn't doing that on purpose, it's just a function of whatever.

00:28:12.147 --> 00:28:16.268
And then I'm like, oh, that's not good, like I don't, I'm a suck up.

00:28:16.268 --> 00:28:22.767
Like, basically, this report is telling me I'm a brown noser, I need to take better care of my people.

00:28:23.470 --> 00:28:23.750
Yes.

00:28:24.520 --> 00:28:28.010
And when I made that shift it was ginormous.

00:28:28.010 --> 00:28:30.827
So, anyways, my point was the 360 survey.

00:28:30.827 --> 00:28:37.573
That's the idea, folks, If you haven't had one and you have an opportunity to do one, there's formal, magical ways to do it.

00:28:37.573 --> 00:28:43.252
Or come up with a set of questions and ask everybody around you those questions.

00:28:43.252 --> 00:28:44.886
You'll learn some stuff.

00:28:45.819 --> 00:28:46.160
Yes.

00:28:46.160 --> 00:28:58.008
So here's the thing, too, is that what I encourage people to do is the success of the project is not just some of the metrics that you see.

00:28:58.008 --> 00:29:03.531
It's also the relationship solid team, or working really well with this other person.

00:29:03.531 --> 00:29:16.271
How does that change some of the things that you're going to focus on?

00:29:16.271 --> 00:29:24.386
And so the book talks about how you can build, how you can strengthen and how you can repair the bridge, and there are nine for each of those.

00:29:24.961 --> 00:29:41.893
It's in that strengthen piece where we talk about what are the expectations and how do you align on or how do you really set good expectations, because I like to say unset expectations are predetermined disappointment.

00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:49.367
Oh, 100%, because, if you don't know, and again, like all these bricks, both sides have to play.

00:29:49.367 --> 00:30:07.288
I need to understand the expectations of my manager, my manager needs to understand my expectations too, and then aligning on goals and then really having that kind of growth mindset, that opportunity hey, we can really grow together.

00:30:07.288 --> 00:30:16.009
Exactly what you're talking about is so important for having the really good relationship that sometimes people don't think about.

00:30:16.009 --> 00:30:17.353
They're like you know what.

00:30:17.353 --> 00:30:21.266
I just need this bid to come in on time.

00:30:21.266 --> 00:30:45.667
Forget everybody else, just get me the information and then sorry, the next person they're going to have to deal with if I cut some corners or whatever so that I could get it in or the person that takes the bid and then actually goes and does the project is wait, this information didn't include everything and so now we're going to be out of scope and then it's upset Right.

00:30:46.009 --> 00:30:55.483
Yes, right, yes, the way I think of that, or the way that lands in my head, is there's the radical chase of outcomes.

00:30:55.483 --> 00:31:09.334
Yes, deliver the damn estimate which causes us to be blind, to like the unintended consequences, specifically in the relationship, human interaction stuff.

00:31:09.334 --> 00:31:22.368
Because, yes, I got the thing done, yeah, but I had to put somebody else on the back burner and I mean it's not to the degree that the team deserves, but my butt was on the line to get it to you by noon and I got it to you by noon.

00:31:22.691 --> 00:31:22.832
Yeah.

00:31:22.880 --> 00:31:29.473
There's going to be collateral damage that plays out in the human interaction relationship space.

00:31:29.473 --> 00:31:30.464
That's, yeah, exactly, exactly.

00:31:30.464 --> 00:31:31.833
That plays out in the human interaction, relationship space.

00:31:31.854 --> 00:32:02.171
That's yeah, exactly exactly and that's the thing that when we have the economy like we do right now, sometimes people shift to that and just putting on a performance metric or an accountability metric that is just mine instead of looking at the bigger picture and we can slip into these, just as we were talking about before transactional relationships instead of really focusing on how the relationship is.

00:32:02.171 --> 00:32:11.762
Here's a funny thing They've actually found that high trust teams are five times more productive that high trust teams are five times more productive.

00:32:11.782 --> 00:32:19.354
Oh yeah, yeah, am I wrong in thinking that high trust teams means conflict is okay?

00:32:22.920 --> 00:32:32.273
Oh, I love that you're asking that question, because people look at the word conflict and they think it's going to be like some loud fisticuffs and all these things.

00:32:32.273 --> 00:32:38.592
You have conflict when you're doing brainstorming, when you have different kind of opinions.

00:32:38.592 --> 00:33:08.731
So when you have a high trust team, it means it should mean that it actually enables those conflict discussions to be navigated so much better, because one of the other pieces when you're looking at repairing the bridge, it's curiosity, it's listening, it's ownership, and so you actually can navigate conflict really well when you have this basis of really solid trust, really solid connection.

00:33:08.731 --> 00:33:13.324
And then you do dive into the curiosity Okay, so what is it?

00:33:13.324 --> 00:33:17.361
And you're trying to understand what the other person is saying oh, why?

00:33:17.361 --> 00:33:22.250
What is it that is so important about that for you?

00:33:22.250 --> 00:33:29.340
And then when you understand that maybe the two of you are actually not as far apart as you thought right, yes.

00:33:29.903 --> 00:33:37.190
Yes, find that common ground which for any company, there's an awful lot of common ground right.

00:33:37.579 --> 00:33:44.050
Yes, yeah, but I'll personalize it for me.

00:33:44.050 --> 00:33:50.407
The reason I couldn't see the common ground is because I was in the state of fear, state of self-preservation.

00:33:50.407 --> 00:33:55.892
So I was blinded to hey, we all get the same check and it has the same signature on it.

00:33:55.892 --> 00:34:01.501
Our jobs and the growth of our company and our careers is contingent on our performance today working together.

00:34:01.501 --> 00:34:12.974
But because I was so, I need to win at all costs, which meant even my teammates had to lose, played out in less than optimal outcomes.

00:34:13.900 --> 00:34:14.442
That's right.

00:34:14.442 --> 00:34:21.262
Yeah, yes, and that's why, a lot of the times, I say, okay, let's go back to the foundation of the bridge.

00:34:21.262 --> 00:34:22.344
Is there trust?

00:34:22.344 --> 00:34:25.431
Is there respect and connection is okay.

00:34:25.431 --> 00:34:27.902
What do you need, jesse, if we're working together?

00:34:27.902 --> 00:34:31.402
What do you need to be your best self at work?

00:34:31.402 --> 00:34:35.090
And what do I need to be my best self at work?

00:34:35.090 --> 00:34:44.188
And if I joke that we play trust chicken sometimes, well, I'll trust you as soon as you trust me.

00:34:44.188 --> 00:34:47.802
Oh yeah, I'm gonna trust you and you can't do that again.

00:34:48.023 --> 00:34:55.608
Right, it's conditional Both sides need to be building together, and respect is this safety that we create.

00:34:55.608 --> 00:35:08.385
So you're right when you are feeling, oh my gosh, I need to perform and I need, and you're like, literally I see people kind of scrunch up and get nervous and, oh my God, things are not working out out.

00:35:08.385 --> 00:35:16.365
I'm so exhale and go back to what's that foundation a how do you trust you?

00:35:16.365 --> 00:35:22.304
How do you trust that you know you're doing the things that you need to do to show up?

00:35:22.304 --> 00:35:26.132
And then also, how do you rebuild some of that trust and respect?

00:35:26.172 --> 00:35:41.692
yes with that other person, potentially throughentially, through getting really curious, potentially it's also through really listening to the other person, and a lot of time it's also hey, wow, I caused some fracture in our bridge and I really want to own that.

00:35:41.692 --> 00:35:51.791
Let's have a discussion and I'm going to own my part, the other person's going to own their part, and then we have this good understanding of how we want to move together, how we want to move.

00:35:53.461 --> 00:35:57.922
You triggered a thought Okay, so I've worked with the leader.

00:35:57.922 --> 00:36:02.507
Or rather, what's your advice here?

00:36:02.507 --> 00:36:15.822
Communicate expectations and never secure commitments, which always turns into resentment and disappointment for them.

00:36:15.822 --> 00:36:19.208
And then I, I'm the guy.

00:36:19.208 --> 00:36:27.409
Then I decide to change my ways, but there's this shadow, the wake right.

00:36:27.409 --> 00:36:32.721
There's this shadow of damage that has informed people of what to expect from me.

00:36:32.721 --> 00:36:45.371
Yeah, now I've changed my behavior, but the shadow doesn't go away, and so I get really impatient and frustrated because they're still not trusting me yes what, what?

00:36:46.072 --> 00:36:46.880
what's the deal there?

00:36:46.880 --> 00:36:48.746
I'm, I'm doing the right.

00:36:48.746 --> 00:36:49.809
Why don't they trust me?

00:36:49.809 --> 00:36:50.869
Yeah?

00:36:50.889 --> 00:36:51.458
yeah, yeah.

00:36:51.458 --> 00:36:52.905
So here's the thing.

00:36:52.905 --> 00:37:05.864
They are making an assumption, right, and that's then I hear the hurt and frustration and hey, Kimberly, I'm doing the right thing, and so what we look at there is okay.

00:37:05.864 --> 00:37:10.753
Some of this, then, is going to be packaging and branding.

00:37:10.753 --> 00:37:19.621
Right, Because one of my favorite quotes from Jeff Bezos is your brand is what people say about you when you're not in the room.

00:37:20.320 --> 00:37:23.846
You can change that brand, okay.

00:37:23.846 --> 00:37:30.072
So, hey, let's, let's create what is that brand that you want to create?

00:37:30.072 --> 00:37:35.905
And then let's over index on some of the communication and so great.

00:37:35.905 --> 00:37:44.967
Here are a few things Proactively tell people hey, I'm wanting to make sure that there's transparency here.

00:37:44.967 --> 00:37:59.793
My timeline is like this and I will let you know if it feels like there's something that's going to affect that, and I'm going to proactively talk to you early on so that there aren't surprises.

00:37:59.793 --> 00:38:11.726
I know that previously there have been surprises and frustrations and whatever, and so here's what I'm doing, so you're just really transparent about how you're continuing to do that.

00:38:12.367 --> 00:38:12.967
And it does.

00:38:12.967 --> 00:38:21.864
It does Because, unfortunately, our brain is primed to remember the like, the negative.

00:38:21.864 --> 00:38:29.896
We then can proactively reprime people's brains to think about it in a positive way.

00:38:29.916 --> 00:38:32.822
right, sometimes it's also just resetting.

00:38:32.822 --> 00:38:35.788
Hey, let's talk about how we work together.

00:38:35.788 --> 00:38:40.422
How would you like to be informed if there are going to be misses?

00:38:40.422 --> 00:38:43.648
How would you like to cool?

00:38:43.648 --> 00:38:44.030
You know what?

00:38:44.030 --> 00:38:49.643
It's really important to me that you feel like you can trust this process again.

00:38:49.643 --> 00:38:53.188
Maybe we were doing like monthly status.

00:38:53.188 --> 00:39:00.617
What if I also, just every two weeks, send you an email status on how it is Right?

00:39:00.617 --> 00:39:15.347
So it's over going on it and it's also I would work with the other person internally to be like okay, I want you to think about where you're getting wins, where these different things.

00:39:15.347 --> 00:39:26.632
So you're also and I'm going to nerd out on the brain for just a second being called the reticular activating system, and your brain primes itself.

00:39:26.632 --> 00:39:32.793
So if you start looking for the ways that it's working instead of the ways it's not working, yes.

00:39:33.980 --> 00:39:40.210
You're going to set yourself up to be successful, because if your brain's always oh, they're never going to believe that I've changed.

00:39:40.210 --> 00:39:45.429
You're going to see that and you're going to also, unfortunately, act accordingly, unintentionally.

00:39:46.911 --> 00:39:50.304
Yep, self-confirming bias right, oh there, it is there.

00:39:50.304 --> 00:39:52.351
It is there and you said it.

00:39:52.351 --> 00:39:53.221
We can program it.

00:39:53.221 --> 00:39:57.706
Totally, yeah, yes, okay.

00:39:57.706 --> 00:40:00.851
So now I'm the flea.

00:40:01.833 --> 00:40:02.092
Yes.

00:40:02.813 --> 00:40:08.402
I'm the flea in the jar and and I got one of those limiting leaders.

00:40:08.402 --> 00:40:11.045
What do I do?

00:40:11.045 --> 00:40:13.887
Do I just shrink to fit in the conditions?

00:40:13.887 --> 00:40:14.827
Do I quit?

00:40:14.827 --> 00:40:16.528
Do I tell them to pound sand?

00:40:16.528 --> 00:40:19.311
What pointers do you have for me?

00:40:20.512 --> 00:40:24.494
The two things that I get most often when I do a talk.

00:40:24.494 --> 00:40:26.257
Jesse, that question.

00:40:26.257 --> 00:40:29.778
And the other one is like do I just burn the bridge?

00:40:29.778 --> 00:40:30.639
At what point?

00:40:30.639 --> 00:40:39.980
Like I've got friends that have gasoline and matches, and like I'm ready ready to go sometimes.

00:40:39.980 --> 00:40:48.052
So those are the two questions I get is if I'm a flea or what bridges should I just burn down?

00:40:48.112 --> 00:40:48.873
Kimberly yes.

00:40:49.675 --> 00:40:49.934
Okay.

00:40:49.934 --> 00:40:51.766
So the flea question.

00:40:51.766 --> 00:40:53.463
This is all.

00:40:53.463 --> 00:41:02.911
Who do you want to be right and how do you want to be Okay?

00:41:02.931 --> 00:41:03.152
Yeah.

00:41:04.101 --> 00:41:13.175
And I had an executive and this person was just in a really hard, hard, hard space.

00:41:13.175 --> 00:41:18.811
Jesse, we know, as a coach, I take confidentiality very, very important.

00:41:18.811 --> 00:41:23.367
There is no way that they can figure out who this is, so I'm not breaking any kind of confidentiality here.

00:41:23.367 --> 00:41:37.969
This client was just in a really, really hard space with a limiting leader, was just in a really, really hard space with a limiting leader and consistently trying to do the right thing and to show up in an incredible place.

00:41:37.969 --> 00:41:44.492
And actually it's funny because, as I'm saying this, I actually can think of five different clients I've had in this space.

00:41:44.492 --> 00:41:48.106
Right, it's a common thing I've been in this space, right?

00:41:48.146 --> 00:41:48.286
Yep.

00:41:48.807 --> 00:41:50.710
And so you need to decide.

00:41:50.710 --> 00:41:52.574
Who do I want to be?

00:41:52.574 --> 00:41:54.844
I'll tell you three things.

00:41:54.844 --> 00:41:56.063
Right, who do I want to be?

00:41:56.063 --> 00:41:59.307
Right, Fundamentally, am I going to shrink or not?

00:41:59.307 --> 00:42:05.048
And my makeup is just don't shrink, it's just in my DNA.

00:42:05.048 --> 00:42:11.710
The second piece, though, is where do I get my value and validation?

00:42:11.710 --> 00:42:15.094
So it doesn't wreck me internally.

00:42:16.240 --> 00:42:16.822
I like that.

00:42:16.822 --> 00:42:18.007
Yes, yes.

00:42:18.199 --> 00:42:26.675
Because that kind of a leader can wreck you and change how you feel about you and your confidence and stuff like that.

00:42:26.675 --> 00:42:29.547
And I'm not going to lie like Jesse.

00:42:29.547 --> 00:42:47.954
That was a big misstep for me and huge learning is I was in, I had a really horribly challenging manager that said some really horribly challenging things and I pretzeled myself to try to prove that I was this incredible leader.

00:42:47.954 --> 00:43:00.507
And again and again and again, and so I started looking for other ways that I would know that I was doing the right thing, because it wasn't going to come from this leader.

00:43:01.449 --> 00:43:01.851
It wasn't.

00:43:02.702 --> 00:43:04.949
And so I just needed to kind of accept that.

00:43:04.949 --> 00:43:08.021
The other piece is then in doing that.

00:43:08.021 --> 00:43:12.284
The third thing is, I would say get your own kind of board of directors.

00:43:12.284 --> 00:43:20.088
Yes, you then navigate that so it's not this one person that potentially is ruining your reputation.

00:43:20.088 --> 00:43:29.972
And then you can and I've had several clients you can move yourself into another role where you are valued.

00:43:29.972 --> 00:43:31.373
It's such a core thing.

00:43:31.373 --> 00:43:38.018
We want to be valued, we want to be seen, and so you just you have to realize, like, where do you get that value?

00:43:38.018 --> 00:43:46.992
And that it doesn't necessarily come from this person, who may or may not be the best equipped manager.

00:43:48.161 --> 00:43:59.001
Oh, the one thing that stands out is find another source for your validation, because you can absolutely do that, and I just love the way you phrase that.

00:43:59.001 --> 00:44:04.353
And no wonder people say, man, this stuff applies at home too.

00:44:04.353 --> 00:44:18.911
Oh yeah, I've been in those relationships where she's just never going to be happy and very, very unhealthy, lost myself entirely trying to contort myself to make her happy.

00:44:18.911 --> 00:44:21.206
Yes, and it was impossible.

00:44:21.206 --> 00:44:32.655
And so, before I burnt and demolished the bridge, I started finding another source to fill my cup from, and that was family.

00:44:32.914 --> 00:44:38.809
And then I burnt the bridge, okay.

00:44:38.809 --> 00:44:46.565
So as far as romantic relationships go, I feel like there isn't one person that's going to be the end, all everything for you.

00:44:46.565 --> 00:44:48.871
This is going to be the end, all everything for you.

00:44:48.871 --> 00:44:52.038
This is going to be the person I do everything with.

00:44:52.038 --> 00:44:56.469
I think it's almost an unfair thing to think that one person can be everything.

00:44:56.469 --> 00:45:09.494
So find some of those pieces from your friends, from your family, from work, from different things, and also find that phenomenal person that lifts you up, that you have this incredible bond with.

00:45:09.494 --> 00:45:21.632
Person that lifts you up, that you have this incredible bond with that loves you deeply and it's, it's, there's like, whatever it takes a village to raise a child, I think it also just takes a village for you to be a whole person too.

00:45:21.652 --> 00:45:25.362
You know, yeah, yeah, which speaks to the personal advisory board.

00:45:25.362 --> 00:45:44.621
Like for me, I, my personal advisory council, has been something I stumbled on, I don't know eight or nine years ago, but it was like man, I want to grow, I want to learn, I want to improve, I want to serve better, and there's a whole lot of gaps that I got and it can't one person fill those gaps.

00:45:44.641 --> 00:45:49.929
So I said, okay, I'm going to talk this person for this, this person for this, this person, and it moves around.

00:45:49.929 --> 00:45:53.213
Yeah, but it's been tremendous it's been, and so the same thing.

00:45:53.213 --> 00:45:53.954
Right, it's okay.

00:45:53.954 --> 00:46:00.987
Where do I get?

00:46:01.027 --> 00:46:04.074
my validation and support and reinforcement.

00:46:04.074 --> 00:46:05.056
From there we go.

00:46:05.056 --> 00:46:14.521
There's another clue Exactly yes, yes, and it makes complete sense, right?

00:46:14.521 --> 00:46:15.090
We go to people for how do I fix my car?

00:46:15.090 --> 00:46:17.456
To a doctor, to finances, to all these different things.

00:46:17.456 --> 00:46:23.407
Of course, it makes complete sense to get your own personal and professional board, and here's the reason it's so, so, so important at work.

00:46:23.407 --> 00:46:26.641
Again, we go back to what your brand is.

00:46:26.641 --> 00:46:31.110
It's a critical thing that you know what your brand is.

00:46:31.110 --> 00:46:36.788
If you don't and for a while I didn't I didn't pay attention to it.

00:46:36.788 --> 00:46:45.572
I had the same thing that your parents did you just head down, work hard and everything good is just going to happen to you.

00:46:46.353 --> 00:46:46.574
Yes.

00:46:47.079 --> 00:46:52.291
It's important to know, because everybody has blind spots and you can't address them.

00:46:52.291 --> 00:46:56.710
Silly sentence you can't address a blind spot unless you know what the blind spot is.

00:46:56.710 --> 00:47:03.690
You also can't know the blind spot if you don't have people that are willing to speak truth to you.

00:47:04.411 --> 00:47:07.114
Oof, yes, yes, yes.

00:47:07.114 --> 00:47:12.903
Which takes us back to trust and conflict like those things.

00:47:12.903 --> 00:47:17.487
I am a heavy advocate for conflict.

00:47:17.487 --> 00:47:36.730
It's my favorite place to be and I'm probably maybe overly comfortable with it because I know and I spent years and years and years dancing so as not to offend anybody.

00:47:37.010 --> 00:47:37.391
Yes.

00:47:37.980 --> 00:47:39.487
And that is misery for me.

00:47:39.820 --> 00:47:47.802
So now I just go straight at it, because I know on the other side of conflict is amazing magical stuff.

00:47:47.802 --> 00:47:58.489
Like for one thing for sure, in every conflict situation I went after, the one thing that always happens is I am 100% clear.

00:47:58.489 --> 00:48:09.083
It may not be in the direction that I want it to be, but I am 100% clear that that person is not in favor of the thing that we were dancing around.

00:48:09.083 --> 00:48:10.567
And so good.

00:48:10.567 --> 00:48:25.050
Now, if you're not going to partner me on me with that, no problem, I'll find somebody else instead of wondering and him Hein and secret message and passive jabs yeah, that kind of junk.

00:48:25.532 --> 00:48:25.711
Yeah.

00:48:26.353 --> 00:48:27.014
Do this go?

00:48:27.014 --> 00:48:28.666
How do you want to do this or not?

00:48:28.666 --> 00:48:36.733
Yeah, I'm getting the sense that this is not something you're as interested in today as you thought you were last month.

00:48:36.733 --> 00:48:45.581
And I've had people like damn, I'm like like no judgment, yeah, this one, it looks like from here and I just need to know.

00:48:45.581 --> 00:48:58.280
And I've had people say, jess, I did, I wanted to be collaborating, but I don't have as much time as I thought I did, so I'm not going to be able to go at the rate that you go.

00:48:59.302 --> 00:49:03.853
Cool, I still love you and whenever you want to get back on the train, let me know.

00:49:03.853 --> 00:49:08.532
But I got to go and I'll go find somebody else that can run with me and it's good.

00:49:08.532 --> 00:49:13.565
Go, and I'll go find somebody else that can run with me and it's good, instead of tiptoeing and fearing and oh my God, what.

00:49:13.565 --> 00:49:14.947
It's almost never been bad.

00:49:14.947 --> 00:49:26.865
But again, the 100% thing that, on my end anyways, is when I go after the conflict on the other side of the conflict is I know for sure where people stand and what the next step is.

00:49:26.865 --> 00:49:30.333
Most of the time it's really awesome and amazing.

00:49:30.333 --> 00:49:34.898
Sometimes it's icky, but I'm clear, I don't have to wonder anymore.

00:49:35.460 --> 00:49:39.451
And you know what that does is that builds the trust.

00:49:39.451 --> 00:49:48.474
Yes and it also builds the respect, because it's hilarious that you say dancing because Sunday.

00:49:48.474 --> 00:49:57.844
It's hilarious that you say dancing because Sunday I co-led a workshop with another coach and we called it Dancing with the Divide.

00:49:57.864 --> 00:50:04.614
And it was all about conflict and how you can advocate conflict through some curiosity and confidence and communication.

00:50:04.614 --> 00:50:06.565
So I love that.

00:50:06.565 --> 00:50:17.039
So I love that.

00:50:17.039 --> 00:50:20.523
And it's really fascinating to me because so many people are conflict averse because they're nervous about what's going to happen.

00:50:20.523 --> 00:50:21.184
And you bridge analogy.

00:50:21.184 --> 00:50:26.728
They're worried that, hey, I cause a fracture and the bridge is going to break down and we're never going to be able to get it back together.

00:50:26.728 --> 00:50:36.016
And the irony is it's exactly the opposite, because once you actually go and pay attention, you know what?

00:50:36.016 --> 00:50:36.197
Jesse?

00:50:36.197 --> 00:50:37.260
I'm going to tell you a quick story.

00:50:38.242 --> 00:51:00.264
So January of last year I did an offsite with this team and they was a leadership team and they were just, they were in such heavy conflict and they we went off site for a few days to maybe an hour and a half, two hours into the session I said, ok, time out.

00:51:00.264 --> 00:51:04.530
I know we've got all these things planned and activities and great stuff.

00:51:04.530 --> 00:51:08.449
We need to sit down and actually just talk.

00:51:08.449 --> 00:51:18.489
We need to sit down and actually just talk, because there's so much conflict and avoidance and frustration across the board.

00:51:18.489 --> 00:51:28.429
We're not even going to be able to do any of these exercises because I was thinking we were in a different place and we need to go to square one.

00:51:29.052 --> 00:51:33.018
We were in a different place and we need to go to square one.

00:51:33.018 --> 00:51:36.242
We need to really back up, and what's really cool is we went through all of this stuff.

00:51:36.242 --> 00:51:41.454
We reset, literally on the fly, changed how the whole day and a half was going to go.

00:51:41.454 --> 00:51:47.072
I don't know if you've ever had that, but that's also really good learning, by the way.

00:51:47.072 --> 00:52:00.469
Like you may have the best of plans, but then you get there and you need to adapt, you need to pivot, you need to pay attention to what's in the field with everybody else, and so we called a timeout.

00:52:00.469 --> 00:52:03.148
I'm not a big football person, but I do know this one.

00:52:03.219 --> 00:52:08.072
We called an audible and changed course, made a few different play adjustments.

00:52:08.072 --> 00:52:11.420
And I, changed course, made a few different play adjustments.

00:52:11.420 --> 00:52:15.931
And I just heard back from them a month ago and this SVP said Kimberly, you know what?

00:52:15.931 --> 00:52:27.273
The stuff that we did on that offsite is still paying dividends Because we go and you go through all of the rupture and you actually do.

00:52:27.273 --> 00:52:41.070
I hate even calling it the hard thing because I feel like that primes the brain the wrong way, but when you navigate through the conflict that you've just been avoiding, we then get to a better place because there wasn't trust.

00:52:42.193 --> 00:52:57.028
There were all these side conversations there wasn't respect, there was cattiness, there were just all these things that people weren't working well together and there was no connection and people were making massive assumptions.

00:52:57.028 --> 00:53:08.434
And now you actually have this group that is working so well together and when they face other things, the bridge is stronger because they know they can go through the rupture.

00:53:08.434 --> 00:53:22.269
They know they can go through the rupture, they know they can repair, they know they have that trust and now every time you go through the conflict it actually improves the bridge for them and I was like I'm so happy.

00:53:22.539 --> 00:53:25.949
The ability and the courage to sense.

00:53:25.949 --> 00:53:26.771
Wait a minute.

00:53:26.771 --> 00:53:32.215
This is not the stuff I got planned for this workshop or this experience.

00:53:32.215 --> 00:53:35.606
Yes, these conditions, this ain't going to work.

00:53:36.047 --> 00:53:36.367
Yeah.

00:53:36.708 --> 00:53:39.943
So that's experience that you brought to the table, which is amazing.

00:53:39.943 --> 00:53:48.489
And then the courage to say we got to have some hard conversations, y'all Like we ain't going to be playing games that ain't going to get us nowhere.

00:53:48.489 --> 00:53:52.951
It'll be fun, it'll be entertaining, but it's not going to have any impact, so we're going to go back.

00:53:52.951 --> 00:54:04.548
Applause to you, ms Kim, because I know how scary and also how exhilarating that is yes, because like you were there, like, oh, I knew it.

00:54:04.548 --> 00:54:07.239
Finally, these people are having the conversation.

00:54:08.581 --> 00:54:14.650
Yes, yeah oh right, you do have to say okay, ego, we're gonna set you over here.

00:54:14.650 --> 00:54:18.315
I understand, it was this beautiful plan of a project.

00:54:18.315 --> 00:54:27.943
We're going to scrap this part and we're going to do this, and I feel like that's also a thing, as leaders, that you need to do.

00:54:27.943 --> 00:54:43.693
When you're not connecting with your team, you need to say okay, we're going to have a moment of humility here and we need we need to do something different instead of just charging through and being like you don't get, a pass you don't get.

00:54:45.221 --> 00:54:48.349
we don't have license to blame them, if we can see it.

00:54:48.731 --> 00:54:53.603
Yes, when I first started managing, I was like I've got this.

00:54:53.603 --> 00:55:07.579
I've had some great managers, I've had some bad managers, I know how to do this and I had this amazing person that I had hired and I thought we're going to kill it.

00:55:07.579 --> 00:55:12.932
This is going to be amazing and the first several months incredible.

00:55:12.932 --> 00:55:21.161
And then and we were working side by side and our ROI return on investment the audience was growing.

00:55:21.161 --> 00:55:27.820
This is back when I was running marketing at a startup and I was on fire so excited.

00:55:27.820 --> 00:55:33.715
And then I thought, hey, I did the golden rule of managing Jessie.

00:55:33.715 --> 00:55:36.925
I'm going to manage her the way that I would want to be managed Well.

00:55:36.925 --> 00:55:44.961
In my mind, that's trust and respect.

00:55:44.961 --> 00:55:48.411
So I wouldn't want somebody sitting with me every day that would feel like you don't really trust me on my own, you don't respect my ability.

00:55:48.411 --> 00:55:56.369
So I said and this is her real name because it ends really well I said, hey, megan, you're going to now own all of this stuff.

00:55:56.369 --> 00:56:00.382
And she originally said great, that's amazing.

00:56:00.382 --> 00:56:04.371
So she goes off Within a matter of weeks.

00:56:04.632 --> 00:56:08.239
Does the ROI start tanking Like audience?

00:56:08.239 --> 00:56:09.981
We were going engagement this way?

00:56:09.981 --> 00:56:12.302
Nope, roi off a cliff.

00:56:12.302 --> 00:56:23.668
Things are being turned in and I had no idea why I was so confused, thinking, hey, we were working really well together.

00:56:23.668 --> 00:56:25.009
You're not turning stuff in.

00:56:25.009 --> 00:56:29.990
Roi is getting so much, just it's crummy, we're not getting conversion.

00:56:29.990 --> 00:56:32.672
All of the metrics just plummeted.

00:56:32.672 --> 00:56:39.556
So first I was really upset with her and blaming her.

00:56:39.556 --> 00:56:50.632
And then I was really upset with me and blaming me and just like you go into that kind of whirlpool of catastrophic thinking I'm a horrible manager, I'm never going to be able to do this.

00:56:50.632 --> 00:56:58.739
What's wrong To thinking, oh my God, I may not be great at marketing, mind you, I've been great at marketing before, but now it's just totally gone.

00:57:00.041 --> 00:57:19.311
And then I paused because my favorite manager is my grandfather and he was an expert at managing and one of the things that he did best, Jesse, was connect with people and find out what they actually needed.

00:57:19.311 --> 00:57:31.503
So I sat down with Megan and at first we were talking about the ROI and why the ads weren't kind of coming in, why she wasn't delivering stuff.

00:57:31.503 --> 00:57:38.626
We talked about why the ROI was tanking, why she wasn't posted, like all these different things, and you hear that keyword.

00:57:38.626 --> 00:57:41.634
I was using why, which is not a great word, right.

00:57:42.221 --> 00:57:43.105
It's accusatory.

00:57:43.840 --> 00:57:44.242
It is right.

00:57:44.242 --> 00:57:46.309
It's got all this built-in crummy stuff to it.

00:57:46.309 --> 00:57:53.634
So I first started changing that and started asking what and how questions.

00:57:53.634 --> 00:57:58.411
I second also started asking her questions about her and what was going on for her.

00:57:58.411 --> 00:58:00.722
Yep, crazy thing.

00:58:00.722 --> 00:58:02.365
Here's what she needed.

00:58:02.365 --> 00:58:07.922
She wanted a 10 minute check-in every morning and a five minute checkout.

00:58:07.922 --> 00:58:11.731
She wanted to know how everything was going.

00:58:11.731 --> 00:58:12.693
She wanted to know.

00:58:12.693 --> 00:58:15.905
Hey, she wanted to tell me that I'm going to be doing.

00:58:16.467 --> 00:58:16.686
Yep.

00:58:17.108 --> 00:58:18.871
She also wanted validation.

00:58:18.871 --> 00:58:21.365
At the end, hey, this is what I did.

00:58:21.365 --> 00:58:22.248
Did it work?

00:58:22.248 --> 00:58:25.206
She wanted to connect about her.

00:58:25.206 --> 00:58:30.264
At the time, boyfriend Ben, now husband, father of her adorable child.

00:58:30.887 --> 00:58:31.148
Wow.

00:58:32.240 --> 00:58:34.748
We started doing that and everything turned around.

00:58:34.789 --> 00:58:35.269
Came back.

00:58:35.269 --> 00:58:37.824
Everything came back, and here's the thing.

00:58:37.983 --> 00:58:42.512
Lest anybody think that she is a high maintenance person.

00:58:42.512 --> 00:58:44.315
She's actually not.

00:58:44.315 --> 00:58:49.210
She is a VP of marketing, absolutely killing it now.

00:58:49.210 --> 00:58:51.065
Right, and she was a rock star.

00:58:51.065 --> 00:58:56.490
I just wasn't managing her the way that she needed to be managed.

00:58:57.112 --> 00:58:57.293
Yes.

00:58:57.380 --> 00:58:58.403
This was a me thing.

00:58:59.007 --> 00:58:59.146
Yes.

00:58:59.659 --> 00:59:08.989
Once I sat down and talked to her and connected with her, everything changed and this is such a game changer thing.

00:59:08.989 --> 00:59:11.369
I can't tell you the number of people.

00:59:11.369 --> 00:59:14.429
I got a workshop about how you connect with people.

00:59:14.429 --> 00:59:16.748
I've talked to executives.

00:59:16.748 --> 00:59:17.510
Here's how you connect with people.

00:59:17.510 --> 00:59:17.750
I've talked to executives.

00:59:17.750 --> 00:59:18.471
Here's how you connect with people.

00:59:18.471 --> 00:59:20.626
It is literally turned around.

00:59:20.626 --> 00:59:29.336
I've had countless executives say I was going to fire this person and then we started having this connection and it is completely different.

00:59:29.336 --> 00:59:38.255
It changes the whole dynamics of the relationship and it is not the heavy lift that people think it is to build relationships.

00:59:38.679 --> 00:59:41.829
It is the crucial lift to build the relationships.

00:59:42.269 --> 00:59:42.911
I love that.

00:59:42.911 --> 00:59:44.746
I love the crucial lift.

00:59:44.746 --> 00:59:50.211
So, summary trust lives in conflict.

00:59:50.211 --> 00:59:54.489
Conflict avoided is conflict multiplied.

00:59:54.489 --> 00:59:59.972
Yes, understand what people value and appreciate.

00:59:59.972 --> 01:00:15.065
So here's a question that I like to ask and, similar to you I did it wrong for so damn long but super simple question that I'd love to get your thoughts on.

01:00:15.065 --> 01:00:23.976
I ask people on a high frequency, especially like people I'm working with direct reports and so forth it's this how can I better serve you?

01:00:23.976 --> 01:00:26.902
Yes, and people.

01:00:26.902 --> 01:00:31.231
When I asked that question, people were like oh, what do you mean?

01:00:31.231 --> 01:00:36.467
Well, we're partnering on this thing, we're working together, like our success is interdependent.

01:00:36.467 --> 01:00:39.003
How can I better serve you?

01:00:39.385 --> 01:00:39.606
Yes.

01:00:39.927 --> 01:00:40.327
What do you need?

01:00:40.327 --> 01:00:41.431
Do you need resources?

01:00:41.431 --> 01:00:42.012
Do you need time?

01:00:42.012 --> 01:00:42.601
Do you need to like?

01:00:42.601 --> 01:00:44.206
Tell me, tell me what it is.

01:00:44.206 --> 01:00:54.360
I'm not saying I'm going to do all of it, but if I know I can at least work towards getting those resources or whatever it is to better serve you.

01:00:54.360 --> 01:00:58.146
Because if I better serve you, the outcomes for all of us are going to be greater.

01:00:58.146 --> 01:01:10.981
And I throw that question out there because I used to have a mindset of oh my God, I got to go hold everybody's hand and I'm supposed to know their stupid dog's name, and I hate freaking dogs.

01:01:10.981 --> 01:01:18.134
And it's not that, it's simply discovering how to better serve them.

01:01:18.134 --> 01:01:27.070
And if I ask that question that way, that's already an immense deposit in the emotional bank account.

01:01:27.070 --> 01:01:30.054
That starts the trust meter running.

01:01:30.054 --> 01:01:30.775
What do you think?

01:01:31.842 --> 01:01:32.505
I love that.

01:01:32.505 --> 01:01:41.753
I absolutely love that, and I think that part of the key of that is is the what do you need?

01:01:41.753 --> 01:01:44.985
Right, and asking it as a serve.

01:01:44.985 --> 01:01:54.657
I think it's also really important to ask, when somebody comes to you and they're really frustrated, to also ask what is it that you want in this moment?

01:01:54.657 --> 01:01:56.324
Because sometimes an event.

01:01:56.583 --> 01:01:58.931
sometimes they really actually want to be appreciated.

01:01:58.931 --> 01:02:01.226
Sometimes they want a solution.

01:02:01.226 --> 01:02:04.248
By the way, this is a great thing to ask you.

01:02:04.248 --> 01:02:08.159
We're talking about relationships at home and other places.

01:02:08.159 --> 01:02:10.668
It's a great, significant other way to ask it.

01:02:10.668 --> 01:02:15.291
It's a great way, if you have teens or younger kids to ask it.

01:02:15.291 --> 01:02:18.148
It's actually a great thing to ask as a to a friend, right?

01:02:18.148 --> 01:02:20.284
What is it that you want?

01:02:20.284 --> 01:02:25.842
What is it that I can do in this moment to your point that's going to serve you best?

01:02:26.663 --> 01:02:31.050
Yes, right, yeah, yeah, all right.

01:02:31.050 --> 01:02:36.282
So my guess is, for anybody that's oh my God, I need more of this.

01:02:36.282 --> 01:02:49.193
They can go and get Me at the Bridge and get the bricks, the nine bricks, and all the frameworks and mental models and directions and magical formulas to enhancing their relationships.

01:02:49.193 --> 01:02:51.405
And do they go to Amazon?

01:02:51.405 --> 01:02:52.690
Do they go to your website?

01:02:53.139 --> 01:02:54.947
Amazon is a great place to go.

01:02:54.947 --> 01:02:56.585
Amazon works really well.

01:02:57.126 --> 01:02:57.981
Okay, there you go.

01:02:57.981 --> 01:02:58.621
Amazon works really well.

01:02:58.621 --> 01:03:03.273
Okay, there you go, and I'll make sure that we get a link in the show notes down there so people can access that.

01:03:03.273 --> 01:03:08.028
Now I kind of brushed over this, but you are a certified coach.

01:03:08.028 --> 01:03:14.664
I mean, you've said it, you coach, you help people with workshops, but you are a certified coach, a bestselling author.

01:03:14.664 --> 01:03:18.630
You've worked with ginormous I mean hell, apple, like biggest damn company.

01:03:18.630 --> 01:03:21.353
Nobody doesn't know Apple.

01:03:21.353 --> 01:03:38.413
So you come with a ton of credibility and am I speaking out of turn by saying you do serve companies, individuals, teams, nonprofit, private enterprise, all of the above You're happy to help them get their stuff more gooder.

01:03:39.800 --> 01:03:42.827
Exactly yes, I have my leadership program.

01:03:42.827 --> 01:03:45.702
So I have a leadership program that came out of this book.

01:03:45.702 --> 01:03:54.181
I have done the leadership program with huge organizations to level up their directors.

01:03:54.181 --> 01:04:00.253
I've also run through a nonprofit and to help with their leadership team.

01:04:00.253 --> 01:04:05.889
I have several clients that are C-level clients as well.

01:04:05.889 --> 01:04:09.762
I have clients that are founders and then middle management.

01:04:09.762 --> 01:04:18.532
So I generally help across the board and across a number of industries and globally.

01:04:18.893 --> 01:04:23.242
So yeah, of course you do, duh Awesome.

01:04:23.242 --> 01:04:26.108
So we'll make sure we'll get your website.

01:04:26.108 --> 01:04:29.302
Which website, if they don't want to wait and they want to hear it.

01:04:29.302 --> 01:04:30.244
What's your website?

01:04:30.525 --> 01:04:39.693
Yeah, so the name of my company is O2U, so from overwhelmed to unstoppable, and I help create unstoppable teams.

01:04:39.693 --> 01:04:55.012
So the website is wwwfrom O for the overwhelmed, to like the number two, u for unstoppablecom, so from O2Ucom, o2ucom.

01:04:56.152 --> 01:05:01.237
Oh, I love that From O2Ucom, with the two in the middle.

01:05:01.237 --> 01:05:04.224
Yes, oh, that is that's.

01:05:04.224 --> 01:05:05.246
You must know.

01:05:05.246 --> 01:05:08.199
You must be marketing, You're a marketing person.

01:05:08.740 --> 01:05:12.391
I mean storytelling, branding, creating connections.

01:05:12.391 --> 01:05:16.009
Those are jam.

01:05:16.210 --> 01:05:16.891
Yes, oh man.

01:05:16.891 --> 01:05:26.728
Well, we've been having so much fun talking about fleas, we didn't get to talk about the other book, and so maybe what do you say?

01:05:26.728 --> 01:05:34.289
We just kind of drop a teaser there and let people know that there is another book currently being baked.

01:05:34.670 --> 01:05:38.826
Yeah, yes, yep, working on it as we speak.

01:05:38.826 --> 01:05:48.811
So, yes, yes, there will be nine bricks, and a few will be the same and most of them will be different.

01:05:49.092 --> 01:05:55.865
so nice, very, and this is the bridge within us yes, yeah, it's the bridge back to yourself.

01:05:55.865 --> 01:05:59.791
Oh my goodness, I'm getting chills, just thinking about it.

01:06:00.251 --> 01:06:02.436
I'm not going to tell y'all anymore.

01:06:02.436 --> 01:06:07.452
You're going to have to come back to hear part two of when that book is ready to launch.

01:06:07.452 --> 01:06:13.215
We'll definitely be talking again, ms Kimberly, and so I got the final question for you, okay?

01:06:13.215 --> 01:06:25.556
And given all your breadth of experience and your heart, it's clear to me how much of your heart you put into the work that you do, the things that you observe and see.

01:06:25.556 --> 01:06:27.485
I'm excited to hear your answer.

01:06:27.485 --> 01:06:28.507
So here's the question.

01:06:28.527 --> 01:06:29.670
All right, I'm ready.

01:06:30.599 --> 01:06:34.190
What is the promise you are intended to be?

01:06:35.382 --> 01:06:40.153
Oh, I love this question, the promise I am intended to be.

01:06:40.153 --> 01:06:41.460
Oh, I love this question, the promise I am intended to be.

01:06:41.460 --> 01:06:50.197
I think it is all about creating those magical connections with people.

01:06:50.197 --> 01:06:54.925
I told you that I really believe that every person has some kind of a gift.

01:06:54.925 --> 01:07:10.849
It is creating that kind of magical connection between people, creating an incredible bridge, creating an incredible learning more about them, really seeing them, appreciating them.

01:07:10.849 --> 01:07:16.322
There's something just magical about those different connections.

01:07:16.443 --> 01:07:35.989
So, yeah, it'd be something around like creating connection, creating magical connection, yeah, oh, I love that and you're doing it Not only like for the people you connect with, me being one of them, but you're also helping other people do that, so you're living that promise I wasn't.

01:07:35.989 --> 01:07:41.186
I'm not surprised at all at how touching your answer or your response is.

01:07:41.186 --> 01:07:42.369
Did you have fun?

01:07:42.952 --> 01:07:43.914
I had so much fun.

01:07:43.914 --> 01:07:46.322
I'm already looking forward to coming back.

01:07:46.322 --> 01:07:48.306
Jesse, we will definitely do this again.

01:07:49.068 --> 01:07:50.231
Yes, ma'am.